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Thread: Tundra frame rust recall???

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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    From what I understand, the problem with the frames rusting like they have been, is because the formula for the steel that was used when the frames were made, is a faulty mixture. This is why the steel will actually peel apart in layers, which is not 'normal rusting'. This faulty mixture apparently allows the steel interior to rust. Usually rust will happen on the outside of the steel first & then eat its way through to the inside.

    I could be wrong... if someone has a better explanation, please let us know.

    Yep, you'd think by now that Toyota would have fixed this problem. However the worrying thing is that this same frame rusting problem was also in the 1990's Toyota Tacoma pickup trucks. And we would all have thought that Toyota would have solved this problem before they released the brand new Tundra line back in 2000. But they did not.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    To update everyone reading this. My buddy was getting jacked around at Bayside Toyota/Chevrolet in Prince Frederick, MD. He was going to allow them to spray the frame because he was tired of hearing the same thing that it was going to cost him over $8000.00 to have his frame replaced. Upon hearing this I told him to pick the truck up before they did any work on it and take it to another Toyota dealership in the area. We did just that!

    He called another dealership and asked how many frame replacements they have done? When he heard several, he decided to take it there for this inspection. He was also told the cost would be zero if the frame did need replacing! After reading on this forum the trouble people have had, and the cost they paid, I wrote a list of questions down for him to ask before dropping his truck off at the dealership. It's because of everyone who wrote about their trucks on this site, that he now seems to be able to better cope with this frame and cost issue.

    One other little note. According to the Bayside dealership when they inspected a complete rust through of the frame located above the control arm. He was told this hole wasn't it a vital area? So no frame replacement was to be done. Not a vital area? What happens when the frame gives way while driving down and the A-Arm does collapse? Add to that, they never removed the bed, or scraped the frame to even see if there were any other holes located in the rest of the frame?

    I'll keep everyone informed once this other dealership looks at his truck? We're taking it there on the 10th of November, and they'll inspect it on the 12th.

    Thanks so much guys!
    Silverstreek
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by shatto View Post
    So, the question seems to be....why can't Americans build a rust-free truck?
    The question as I see it, is why Toyota CANNOT solve their rust problems after having many, many years/models of experience with rust????

    They build a nice truck that competes with anyone. They need to learn how to build a truck that will last, is the missing link for consumers.

    As noted here:


    Toyota Truck Rust Problems | Tundra Headquarters Blog
    Last edited by jbtoy; 11-07-2012 at 07:59 AM.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by silverstreek View Post
    I'll keep everyone informed once this other dealership looks at his truck? We're taking it there on the 10th of November, and they'll inspect it on the 12th.

    Thanks so much guys!
    Silverstreek
    Thanks a lot for this update Silverstreak, very much appreciated. Looking forward to your next update & I hope your buddy has better luck with this other dealership.

    Quote Originally Posted by jbtoy View Post
    Wholly cow! I didn’t know the rust problems were still happening with the Tundra 2nd generations! That is Not good at all!
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by jbtoy View Post
    The question as I see it, is why Toyota CANNOT solve their rust problems after having many, many years/models of experience with rust????

    They build a nice truck that competes with anyone. They need to learn how to build a truck that will last, is the missing link for consumers.
    I think it comes down to the process in which they make the frames and the coating of them. I starting noticing the flaking or "exfoliation" corrosion is what I believe it's called with the T100. I talked with a mechanical/materials engineer here at work briefly about it, but he didn't have the information off the top of his head how it occurs with the processing of the metal to make the frames. He's seen it in other structures we've built.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by sg1efc View Post
    From what I understand, the problem with the frames rusting like they have been, is because the formula for the steel that was used when the frames were made, is a faulty mixture. This is why the steel will actually peel apart in layers, which is not 'normal rusting'. This faulty mixture apparently allows the steel interior to rust. Usually rust will happen on the outside of the steel first & then eat its way through to the inside.

    I could be wrong... if someone has a better explanation, please let us know.

    Yep, you'd think by now that Toyota would have fixed this problem. However the worrying thing is that this same frame rusting problem was also in the 1990's Toyota Tacoma pickup trucks. And we would all have thought that Toyota would have solved this problem before they released the brand new Tundra line back in 2000. But they did not.
    The big issue for my buddy is his wife special ordered a brand new 07 Tundra Limited when they were first introduced. Her tundra has less than 40,000 miles on the odometer, but I would have to guess her frame looks nasty? She's received the typical recall notice, but has yet to take hers in for them to inspect.

    It is my hope being my own 2012 Tundra is immune to this kind of rust? I was thinking of putting mine in the air on my lift and doing a complete under-body rust-proofing? My fear is if I do this? I wonder if Toyota wouldn't honor any rusting issues in the future because I did this on my own? I also know undercoating the frame and other items doesn't mean everything is completely protected. Although, I did notice a sticky film on the frame when I installed my stainless steps. I have to wonder if this sticky film is some kind of steel protection for the frame itself? I guess time will tell?
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by silverstreek View Post
    It is my hope being my own 2012 Tundra is immune to this kind of rust? I was thinking of putting mine in the air on my lift and doing a complete under-body rust-proofing? My fear is if I do this? I wonder if Toyota wouldn't honor any rusting issues in the future because I did this on my own?
    Not sure if the 2012's are going to have the same problems in the future, but, if I had a 2012 and planned to keep it for many years, I would protect it now.
    If done right (rustproofing) with periodic cleaning of the undercarriage, you will be fine for many years. Protection is insurance as prevention. That is a better approach
    than waiting to learn the hard way 5+ years out, that damn, it is rusting away and Toyota says outside of warranty, sorry.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    I have mine at the dealer now. They keep coming up with more and more things to fix now its the rear end pumpkin has rust and should be replaced. I already ok'd the timing belts and drive line fluid changes.
    Did anyone else have a pumpkin rot out too? I thought they were cast and really thick? The mechanic fixing it seems pretty up front. He is sending me pics of it now. Also my hellwig bar hardware is rotted , so I need to order a new bar or just the kit to re-install it. They sent me some end link kit instead. I also bought all new shocks 5100 series....one was leaking figured might as well change 'em now.
    LMK if you have had the pumpkin changed and if Toyota covered it . thanks......
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by silverstreek View Post
    The big issue for my buddy is his wife special ordered a brand new 07 Tundra Limited when they were first introduced. Her tundra has less than 40,000 miles on the odometer, but I would have to guess her frame looks nasty? She's received the typical recall notice, but has yet to take hers in for them to inspect.

    It is my hope being my own 2012 Tundra is immune to this kind of rust? I was thinking of putting mine in the air on my lift and doing a complete under-body rust-proofing? My fear is if I do this? I wonder if Toyota wouldn't honor any rusting issues in the future because I did this on my own? I also know undercoating the frame and other items doesn't mean everything is completely protected. Although, I did notice a sticky film on the frame when I installed my stainless steps. I have to wonder if this sticky film is some kind of steel protection for the frame itself? I guess time will tell?
    Quote Originally Posted by jbtoy View Post
    Not sure if the 2012's are going to have the same problems in the future, but, if I had a 2012 and planned to keep it for many years, I would protect it now.
    If done right (rustproofing) with periodic cleaning of the undercarriage, you will be fine for many years. Protection is insurance as prevention. That is a better approach
    than waiting to learn the hard way 5+ years out, that damn, it is rusting away and Toyota says outside of warranty, sorry.
    I can be completely wrong about this, but from what I have been told; since the mixture/ingredients of the steel for these frames is not correct, it will not stop the rust from continuing. However, everyone MUST have this done as far as I know, to abide by the NHTSA recall and to comply with Toyota's directive, to ensure that any future warranty/liability by Toyota will be honored. If you don't have the rustproofing or frame replacement done if Toyota tells you to have it done, you may violate your extended warranty for this problem. Now this warranty seems to be as stated by Toyota "to be handled on a case by case basis", so you want to make sure to have the rustproofing done if Toyota tells you to. If you don't, you might even somehow be liable by the Feds for not complying with the terms of a safety recall. By the way, I do Not work for Toyota, NHTSA or anyone else in the Federal Government or auto industry.

    My understanding (and I could be wrong) is that rust can actually form inside the metal of the frame. Usually with steel that has been made with the correct ingredients and proportions thereof, the rust would appear on the outside first and then eat its way through normally. This problem is different: The rust can start anywhere it wants, rust on the outside first or it can even start on the inside and we won't even know it's there until it comes through to the outside. Since the rust can form on the inside of the steel, it results in the steel separating from itself in layers, like a flaky pie crust or apple strudel crust.

    Two things that have me worried is that having the rust proofing compound put on can actually block our visual view of how bad the rust is getting. Also it can actually hold in the moisture from water splashing up on the frame or just from condensation forming from the air, if the outside rust is not properly removed before application. From what I think I understand, it is at the molecular level - the proportions of ingredients in the steel mixture at the time the frames were made, was either incorrect or did not have the proper ingredients to create a strong rust-resistant type of steel suitable for a vehicle's frame.

    I looked at my frame and there are various cut-outs in it, for example I remember at least one rounded corners rectangular hole and some regular holes that are all part of the manufacturing process. When anyone applies any type of rust-proofing compound, do they actually somehow apply it to the inside areas of the frame, since the frame is considered hollow or "tubular"? Meaning, the frame is not a solid piece of steel, it actually has 4 sides and an air space in the middle throughout the frame. So any splashed up water or condensation can very easily form or sit inside the hollow part of the tubular frame. Therefore, in order for the rust-proofing compound to be applied in the most beneficial way, it would have to be applied to the inside (the 'back side of the frame' if you will) of the frame also. And even if this were done, it could be pointless right? My 2000 Tundra is old and no doubt has rust on the inside of the frame already that can not be seen, nor can this rust be properly removed, which it should be if you are going to apply the rust proofing compound.

    It is my belief that Toyota's applying the rust proofing is a deal they made with NHTSA and even from what I was told at Team, they know this rust proofing compound is not a solution, at best I think it is a delay for the inevitable. The two good things I can say about Toyota is that my Tundra has been incredibly reliable and the greatest vehicle I've ever owned. The other thing is that Toyota seemed to care enough about the Tacoma owners who also had this same rust problem to buy them out as mentioned by Jbtoy above in this article: Toyota Truck Rust Problems – What’s Going On?

    By the way Silverstreek, Toyota did mention I believe in at least one of the recall notices that I received, that if anyone had already applied the rust-proofing compound by someone other than Toyota, Toyota would reimburse them for it. I have no idea if the 2012 Tundras also have this same rust problem or not, only thing I can think of & suggest is calling up Toyota's H.Q. and asking (demanding?) to know if your frame is also vulnerable to rust.

    For all the spectacular reliability, great ride, never breaking down, etc. that I have had with my Tundra, this rust issue is a safety problem that is definitely big enough to make me consider buying my next vehicle either from another manufacturer like Honda, or to get a different Toyota model that does not have this rusting problem.

    If there are any official people from Toyota reading this thread, we'd all love to have any official info you may have for us about this, if there is anything new that we do not know about. You may also feel free to correct anything I have written if anything is not correct. Thanks.
    Last edited by sg1efc; 11-08-2012 at 01:51 PM.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    This has been going on since the early 80's..... I had a 1980 pickup rust bucket 300k miles ran great, also had a 1988 .....250k and ran great rusted up through the rear fenders and frame was a mess.
    Who knows......doesn't in the least surprise me the new ones are rusting they would lose the moniker rustota.....
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    The thing for me was I did tons of research on different trucks before buying my 2012 this year. Ford has engin problems with both their gas and diesel trucks from 2003 to 2010. The 2011 and 2012 diesel trucks were so darn expensive, and the new diesel engines haven't been on the market long enough to prove they didn't have problems that I decided not to buy a ford. Chevy and GM 5.3's have something like 318 HP, and their resale value sucks! As Ram goes, I got screwed by the parent company years ago, and I've never gotten over how we were treated.

    I was sold on the 381 HP, and the value of the Tundra 4X4 is so much more that I decided it was the best bang for the buck. I've had it for six months now and only put 2300 miles on it. Even with the rust problems on some of the older tundras, right now I would still buy another Tundra over the competition. I just hope I don't end up eating my words, at 57 years old, I was hoping this was the last new truck I'd be purchasing? The main problem for me is the type of salt they use on the roads during the winter for ice and snow. The good thing is it doesn't snow a lot around here. The bad thing is, even using a pressure washer under your vehicle doesn't get this crap off. They say this salt is so bad on metals that water re-activates the salt. It certainly isn't salt, but thats what the State calls it?

    However, I do think I'll order some SEM rust-proofing material and spray the under side of the truck.

    Again, Thanks for the ideas and write-ups. It all helps.
    Silverstreek
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    I know what you mean Silverstreek. Back in 2000 I also researched: Ford had brake problems I think, Ram had transmission problems, the Silverado had a couple problems. Was all set to get a F-150 when my neighbor showed me a Consumer Reports review for pickups. That's where I first learned that Toyota had come out with the Tundra.

    Oh, something for you to consider Silverstreek: I 'think' that Toyota removes the bed from the frame, to allow the spraying of the top of the frame. Not sure if you spraying yourself will have the same result = are you planning on spraying your frame with the bed removed? I'm not sure how Toyota would react if they are removing the bed & spraying all around the frame, compared to others who do not remove it & rust happens later = will Toyota still honor any replacement frame or other work in the future? Or will they say that you should have had us spray it...?
    Last edited by sg1efc; 11-08-2012 at 01:56 PM.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Quote Originally Posted by sg1efc View Post
    I know what you mean Silverstreek. Back in 2000 I also researched: Ford had brake problems I think, Ram had transmission problems, the Silverado had a couple problems. Was all set to get a F-150 when my neighbor showed me a Consumer Reports review for pickups. That's where I first learned that Toyota had come out with the Tundra.

    Oh, something for you to consider Silverstreek: I 'think' that Toyota removes the bed from the frame, to allow the spraying of the top of the frame. Not sure if you spraying yourself will have the same result = are you planning on spraying your frame with the bed removed? I'm not sure how Toyota would react if they are removing the bed & spraying all around the frame, compared to others who do not remove it & rust happens later = will Toyota still honor any replacement frame or other work in the future? Or will they say that you should have had us spray it...?
    Good point about the bed! I do have a 6000 lb lift in my shop that makes easy work of lifting a truck bed off of it's frame. I'll have to be extra careful to set things up so I don't scratch the paint! As for undercoating. jbtoy also suggested I go ahead right now and undercoat the entire underbelly of the truck. After reading what some have written and suggested, I believe it's in my best interest to take care of this now!

    There is a company who produces a great product for vehicle undercoating. Not only does it keep rust at bay, it also deadens sound. Right now I'm in the process of finding out how much the SEM product along with the needed application gun is going to cost me? The good thing about buying a professional application gun is, there is a long wand available that allows the tech to get into tight areas (like a boxed part of the frame) Once I find out what I need? I'll let everyone know what the cost is? Just in case there may be a few other crazy people like myself who want to see if they can save their frames?

    Thanks again guys,
    Silverstreek
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Cool, let us know how it goes Silverstreek.
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    Default Re: Tundra frame rust recall???

    Was the undercoating that toyota dealerships charged for worth a darn in preventing rust, I remember seeing on the window sticker saved in the glove compartment of my used truck purchase that the truck had an undercoating treatment that cost the original purchaser 600ish dollars. I will say that I can't find a single speck of rust on my 2000 Tundra truck frame, it is spotless under there.
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