The good, the bad and the confusion with my recently attempted brake job

[lelandstanford]

When I spoke to some techs at a local Isuzu commercial truck dealer on auto vs. manual, here's impressions I got (Aisin auto vs Isuzu manual):

1. The reason more work trucks are auto is because typical Americans can't drive stickshift properly. For N-series, a multiple-driver manual truck sees dealer ever 1-2 years (worn clutch/transmission) whereas an automatic does not need transmission related repair until 200K+.

2. Engine braking is no different from acceleration as far as transmission wear is concerned.

3. It maybe cheaper to rebuild brakes than transmission but without engine braking. Cost of brake jobs, downtime and safety outweighs a transmission rebuild (in 200k).

[MEvang]

Originally Posted by kevinp

This has been a great discussion as other possibilities have arisen and the clear oversight by all the manufacturers would have been an idiot light that came on when your brakes got to a particular temperature. Then instructions in the owners manual that would instruct the driver to shift down and or slow down. With this system we would have taught another generation how to drive. With the new infrared non contact technology this would be a pretty easy addition these days.

Being in the brake service business for years I can say this would not be a bad idea. You know it all comes down to common sense and a basic knowledge of what limits your vehicle systems have. I have seen many brake systems destroyed from "pedal riders" but if you where to ask them, "do you ride the brakes" they would be offended. One thing I've learn from working on cars all my year is "parts don't lie!"
I did look up engine braking in my 02 manual, under Automatic Transmission use. There is a lot here about of what speed you can down shift to a given range. Downshift to low at 80 and you'll likely break something of course.
They do caution that abrupt down shifting on slippery surface could cause loss of control. They also caution not to over-rev the engine, watch the tach and give more speed ranges.
They caution that continued hard use (towing or hill climbing) in low or 2 can cause transmission damage from overheating. They say that drive should be used for these conditions.
In the towing section they state to not tow with the overdrive on.

You names some of the best automatic trans ever built. But one thing that turn me from GM to Toyota was transmissions. It seemed that GM can't built an automatic that last anymore. 700 r4 (that can be built to last), commonly fail between 50 and 100k Early Chryslers 4speeds couldn't make 50k and some Ford truck transmissions need a $1500 upgrade to make them durable. No wonder Toyota is kicking their behinds.
Mike

[t1704]

Well, I finally did the long anticipated brake job and can see there's been some other discussions since I last visited. (Sorry for the delay) Saturday, I put on the Brembo rotors, Hawk pads and adjusted the rear brakes. So far, braking power is great and more importantly "smooth". I'll just drive easily and hope the pulsation doesn't come back. Thanks for everyone's imput and suggestions.

Travis

[t1704]

A couple of months later and they're still working great.

[MEvang]

I now have two over years on the brake caliper upgrade, factory pads and Brembo rotors. No problems truck stops great.
Mike

[Cian]

Originally Posted by t1704

I unpack the hawk pads and can't believe how small they are, definitely one of the reasons the brakes are junk. As I crawl down to start loosing the calipers bolts...BAM, I notice they're the 13we ones, great news I thought, someone has already upgraded the calipers.

Sorry for bringing up an older thread, but I thought the "13WE" calipers were in fact the older smaller calipers?

Weren't the later models equipped with the "13WL" calipers which were the larger ones?

[t1704]

Cian, I may have misquoted the numbers, but it did have the larger ones already installed. It's been six months now and they're still working great. I do however adjust the rears every couple of months.

[myardnut]

Originally Posted by Cian

Sorry for bringing up an older thread, but I thought the "13WE" calipers were in fact the older smaller calipers?

Weren't the later models equipped with the "13WL" calipers which were the larger ones?

That is correct. The factory originals are 199mm calipers and marked "13WE". The newer ones are 231mm and marked "13WL. I am wondering as well if the OP has the old calipers in there and they were never upgraded. Sure sounds like it from the description.

[KLINDSEY]

Originally Posted by MEvang

I now have two over years on the brake caliper upgrade, factory pads and Brembo rotors. No problems truck stops great.
Mike

Mike;
You and I have talked about this problem before, and I have about 50k on my last brake job of new rotors and some quality pads, I have not upgraded to the bigger calipers as they were a lot of money upfront a few years back. Back to what I was saying I have had no more brake problems since I started using my E brake more often, I use to adjust my rear brakes, now I just set and release my E brake when parking or while waiting at long traffic lights a couple times a week. No more problems I will be upgrading to the larger calipers at the next brake job just because I can do it cheaper now, but I will still use the E brake at stop lights.
Kevin

[t1704]

Just a quick update. It's been over a year now and the breaks are still working great. Unfortunately just setting the E-brake on mine doesn't adequately adjust the rears, so every few months I crawl underneath and do it manually. I can deifnitly feel when the rears are starting to get out of adjustment and with a couple of "clicks", runs tight again.