Brake TSB - Dealer Payment Offer-Pls Advise

[evcv]

I have a 2WD Extended Cab Tundra purchased in May, 1999 with 54Kmiles. I've been watching the Brake problem and decided not to bring my truck in and go through the several tries at fixing the problem until I got some assurance that their was a "Final" fix. In Sept of 2002, Toyota finally decided to replace the entire wheel brake asm at the front and replace the drums in the rear. It's my understanding that the problem has now been fixed.

Also, one of my rear quarter panel latches broke (plastci - bad design) and I found out, it too had a TSB. (The Tundra truck must have set a record for # of TSBs issued for vehicle in Toyota's product line- must be over 20=rushed to market with inadequate testing).

So, last week I went to my dealer and asked them to fix my brakes and my window latches under the TSBs, and of course they said, sorry, your past 3yr/36K but they said they would talk to Toyota and see if they could offer me some "good will". They are a good dealer, but they've held their guns on the 3yr/36K thing as they in the past refused to pay for the installation of a third failed oxygen sensor that went out at 39K miles (Toyota paid for it after I appealed it back to Toy HQ in Calif. Now they have bit the bullit and acknowleged that they onece again, had selected a bad part and is extyending the warranty.)

The dealer came back and offered me a deal: I pay half of the warranty work = 2200$ total so my share is 1100$. They are invoicing me retail for the parts for 1/2 of 1507$.

My expectations is:
Toyota should pay 100% of the TSBs as the fixes came after my truck was out of warranty for the brakes. Regarding the window latches: Toyota should pay 100% as the failure has nothing to do with mileage and time: mostly related to enviroment and # of actuations. I'm a reasonalbe guy so I should be expected to pay for a brake job (front only) as at my mileage, I would need one under normal wear and tear. My rear brake shoes are hardly worn so I should not pay anything for work done at the rear.

My questions:
1. What would you do?
2. Is 1100$ a fair deal for the work?
3. I'm anticipating that Toyota will increase the warranty on the Brakes (like they have done for the O2 sensors because their final fixes occurred after many vehicles had past their 3yr/36K.

I dont know about you guys, but this is the absolute worst vehicle I've owned regarding # TSBs. I think the brand Tundra will have to be killed (like T100) because of its poor parts quality. I think Toyota should pull the design center out of Michigan and move it to Texas as they've hire way too many ex big 3 truck designers and their talents are really showing on the Tundra. (yes this truck was designed by mostly ex big 3 truck designers - so go figure, toyota got the guys who were willing or had to jump ship from the big three and now we're feeling the results of their talents).

PS: Yes, I'm an engineer and I can recognize poor designs and know when something is funny regarding excessisve quantity of TSBs: Mgnmt pushed for early GA of the truck- a year ahead of time. Engineers didn't have enough test time to field out the problems. Shame on Toyota!

[KLS]

Keep in mind that the dealer is only the middleman in warranty repairs. They can only do what Toyota Corp. pays for.

Keep hammering Toyota HQ.

How bad are your brakes? You might have the rotors turned if necessary and try some Raybestos PG or other top quality non-Toyota brake pads. You might do the same for the rears, maybe even buying Raybestos or other drums.


Ken

[longwoodklon]

I know what you're saying. I had brake problems early though so that got the initial fix, never went back to argue with them to get the upgraded rotors cause when I called them they said they would have to have their guy drive it and then have to talk to corporate because I was out of warranty. Thought it was bogus cause I was already on file with the problem, it should have been a 'no brainer'. In all honesty, the brakes are fine, I just wanted to get the final fix. Now with my Seq. I got lucky cause it was still in warranty so they couldn't argue much about it.
And the crappy plastic window latches, yeah I had them break after the warranty was up too. Called around and basically got no where, just ordered them from Carson Toyota for like $20/each. I told my dealer that for such a small price, I'd think they'd want to keep a customer happy, guess not.
Maybe it's me, but life is too short to have to complain incessantly just to get what should be expected.
Back to your brakes. I'd never pay that. I'd push since this is in the $$$$$$. And as a last resort, if they didn't own up to the problem themselves, I'd go to Wheeler's and get the cryo'd slotted/drilled rotors and kevlar pads. Total for the fronts I think is around $350.
/Mike

[evcv]

I have a 2WD Extended Cab Tundra purchased in May, 1999 with 54Kmiles. I've been watching the Brake problem discussions for years and decided not to bring my truck in and go through the several tries at fixing the problem until I got some assurance that there was a "Final" fix. In Sept of 2002, Toyota finally decided to replace the entire wheel brake asm at the front and replace the drums in the rear. It's my understanding that the problem has now been fixed.

Also, one of my rear quarter panel latches broke (plastic- bad design) and I found out, it too had a TSB. (The Tundra truck must have set a record for # of TSBs issued for vehicle in Toyota's product line- must be over 20=rushed to market with inadequate testing).

So, last week, after I waited over a year to make sure this time the fix worked, I went to my dealer and asked them to fix my brakes and my window latches under the TSBs, and of course they said, sorry, your past 3yr/36K but they said they would talk to Toyota and see if they could offer me some "good will". They are a good dealer, but they've held their guns on the 3yr/36K thing as they in the past refused to pay for the installation of a third failed oxygen sensor that went out at 39K miles (Toyota paid for it after I appealed it back to Toy HQ in Calif. Now I see Toyota has bit the bullit and acknowleged that they once again, had selected a bad part/vendor and is extyending the warranty to 7yr/90K for the 02 sensors.)

The dealer came back and offered me a deal: I pay half of the warranty work = 2200$ total so my share is 1100$. They are invoicing me retail for the parts for 1/2 of 1507$. Can you believe Toyota has the guts to try to make a profit on the parts for the TSB out of my pocket! Do they think we're stupid such that we cant figure out what their cost is for the labor and the parts ?

My expectations is:
Toyota should pay 100% of the brake TSB as the fixes came after my truck was out of warranty for the brakes. How can Toyota release a TSB that covers vehicles that are out of the TSB warranty period of 3yr/36Kmiles (my Tundra was 40 months old with 42K miles onit when the final fix for the brakes was issued) and expect the customer to pay for half the repair bill? Granted, I should pay for a brake job which is normal wear and tear, but nothing more.

Regarding the window latches: Toyota should pay 100% as the failure has nothing to do with mileage and time: mostly related to enviroment and # of actuations. They should fess up to another poor design. I expect that near 100% of Tundra owners with plastic latch link will experience a failure or two.

My questions:
1. What would you do? Besides appealing back to Toy/Calif HQ?
2. If you had to pay, how much would you expect to pay for the work?

I believe that 00-02 Tundras without this final brake fix will take a hit on resale value as the word is well known on the streets about the Tundra brake fiasco.

I dont know about you guys, but this is the worst vehicle I've owned regarding # TSBs. Just way too many broken parts too early in its life. I think the brand Tundra may have to be killed (like T100) because of its poor parts quality. Toyota should pull the design center out of Michigan and move it to Maine or some other place as they've hired way too many ex big 3 truck designers/engineers/planners/ and their talents are really showing on the Tundra. Yes, sad to say, this truck was designed by mostly ex big 3 truck designers - so go figure, Toyota got the guys who were willing or had to jump ship from the big three and now we're feeling the results of their talents. No wonder why the dipstick was the wrong length! And I love the one about stripping out the threads in the manifold when replacing the O2 sensor (a little chemistry & basic material knowlege would have prevented this screw-up).

PS: Yes, I'm an engineer and I can recognize poor designs and know when something is funny regarding excessisve quantity of TSBs. My bet: Mgnmt pushed for premature launch/GA of the truck- I would say about a year ahead of time of when it should have hit the streets. QA/Test/Engineers didn't have enough test time to field out the problems from the ace ex big three design team as they had base their schedules on previously designed vehicles designed by Toy engineers. Shame on Toyota! Glad to see Nissan has entered into the playing field. And soon more new players. If Toyota keeps screwing up, Chevrolet/Ford & now Nissan are going to get a chance to get their act together and stomp Toyota down into place like the big 2 did with the little truck seqment in the late 80's after the asians had owned the small truck market.

The Tundra was and still is not ready for prime time. They'll never pentrate the fleet sales with the record they've created for themselves. And now I'm hearing reports of plenty of tranny failures to boot! And get this: they're putting plastic bumpers on them (entered into the cost reduction phase)- oh that's real smart too! I guess maybe it was meant to be a show truck.

[junktundra]

Man, welcome to the club I've had almost all the same frustrations and nothing has been fixed (on the brakes anyway). I did switch dealers and had a cracked left exhaust manifold and O2 sensor replaced for free after I was outside of 3/36 warranty. The damn "check engine" light is on again though. Hopefully they will cover the O2 sensor AGAIN under the new warranty extension.

[nhparrot]

Duplicate threads merged