Oil change light: Based on miles or viscosity?

[Jer]

Originally Posted by yspert

since i'm stupid, then i guess i just don't understand why one should
change their oil at all. why not just change the filter? yspert

For the exact reason I stated... the oil can only heat cycle so many times before the viscosity breaks down. FWIW, a lot of people who run synthetic and change every 10k will also change their filter every 5k miles. I've seen people change oil filters every other oil change but I highly oppose that practice.

[Marty358]

OK, this is getting out of hand. The Toyota dealer in my area will not honor a claim if it is higher than the interval in the owner's manual. The does not matter if it was synthetic or conventional oil. I don't know what your dealer does, but the dealer I use will not do an oil analysis. They will just deny the claim. If it isn't documented, it wasn't performed. No new engine on Toyota's dime.

[mral1515]

Originally Posted by Marty358

OK, this is getting out of hand. The Toyota dealer in my area will not honor a claim if it is higher than the interval in the owner's manual. The does not matter if it was synthetic or conventional oil. I don't know what your dealer does, but the dealer I use will not do an oil analysis. They will just deny the claim. If it isn't documented, it wasn't performed. No new engine on Toyota's dime.

The dealer doesn't have that right. However they can suggest to the Toyota district Mgr. what they want. If they find any type of build up in engine and this build up caused the failure. You better be able to provide some oil change documents at that point. If a dealer denies you any type of warranty assistance you can always contact Toyota yourself and have them investigate for you.

We do not do any type of oil analysis at my dealer. Most case you can tell by looking. If you can't tell looking tie goes to the customer in my book.

[Jer]

Originally Posted by Marty358

OK, this is getting out of hand. The Toyota dealer in my area will not honor a claim if it is higher than the interval in the owner's manual. The does not matter if it was synthetic or conventional oil. I don't know what your dealer does, but the dealer I use will not do an oil analysis. They will just deny the claim. If it isn't documented, it wasn't performed. No new engine on Toyota's dime.

The Toyota dealer has no right to deny a claim as I've already stated. They get the info and get authorization from Toyota to perform warranty work. Any type of deny would come from Toyota and if the dealership is denying you work then they're denying profit because they get paid on ALL warranty work but the manufacturer, no questions asked. This is why I'm amazed at people that say a dealership denied to do their warranty work. They work for money too just like everyone else. As far as it not mattering it does because conventional motor oil will break down quicker given the same circumstances than synthetic motor oil. The manufacturer doesn't care how many miles since your oil change, all they care about is the oil level and the condition of the oil in the engine itself. If you drive lighter and use synthetic motor oil your oil will last substantially longer than someone who uses conventional motor oil and/or pushes their vehicle hard every time they crawl behind the wheel. The only way to know is an oil analysis and I don't know of many dealers that offer this service but there are many places around the country that perform this test. I can't believe I'm even having this discussion with people who don't even know about oil analysis because you're basing your entire side of the discussion on the simple fact that oil is only good for a certain number of miles. There's a LOT more to it than that. Think about it... do you replace your accessory belts at a set interval or when they show signs of wear or failure? What about your tires, do you replace them at a set amount of miles or when they show sings or wear or fail? Oh, really? Matter of fact, there's not too man parts on a car that we replace before some signs of wear or complete failure so why is the idea of oil being the same so foreign to you? Why is it that oil is only good for a set amount if miles but everything else is good until it shows signs of no longer being good? So, who told you you needed to change the oil every 3k miles? The bottle of oil? Well, that's convenient, isn't it? The distance deadline added to miles is for the stupid. It's easy to remember and anyone who can think for themselves can realize why oil is needed, what it does, when it needs to be changed and how to know.

Do you check your oil EVERY fuel fill up for not only level but viscosity, contaminants and foreign smells? I doubt it. Well, I do and I know a little more about motor oil than you so don't proceed to tell me that how I'm doing things is wrong because there isn't a manufacturer on this planet that will deny an engine repair because your oil was at 5,001 miles and the oil itself was just fine. If they did they would have a hell of a lawsuit on their hands or they would be just fine because the victim would be an uneducated consumer that thought they were in the wrong and let a manufacturer push them around.

/conversation

[Marty358]

You have no idea how well I maintain my cars or how often I have changed timing belts, because I had one snap on me 17 years ago. So yes, I do change them before their life cycle. But back to the discussion. One of my coworkers had a Matrix that the engine went bad at about 30000 miles. She went to the dealer and they said show us your oil change records. She didn't have them, so they said they wouldn't honor the warranty. She took it to another car dealer and traded it. No oil analysis, and yes I know what it is. It is performed on airplanes all of the time, I just think it is a waste of money for a car.

[LifeTech]

Originally Posted by Jer

No, sludge is a term used to describe the oil when it's viscosity breaks down after thousands of heat cycles. Synthetic has the ability to heat cycle roughly twice as many times as conventional oil and therefore can be ran longer than conventional motor oil. If you have 'crap' building up in your engine then you need a better oil filter because it's job is to filter out all the contaminates that are suspended within the oil. The oils job is to lubricate all of the parts of the motor that are metal on metal. Over time and after many many heat cycles the oil will start losing it's ability to lubricate these parts and friction begins to occur. The result is added heat which also speeds up the process of the oil turning to sludge.

Bottom line is if you're oil is still good then it's still good. Sure you can change your oil weekly if you like but you would be stupid and throwing money out the window. I have managed to get hundreds of thousands of miles out of numerous vehicles doing it my way and have yet to have an engine fail because I didn't change the oil often enough.

Hey Jer, I like yu. Yu make sense to me.
UOA's work for me too.

Use dino if yu plan on doing OCI's every 200 miles. Even that is a waste.

True that TMS authorizes major engine repairs under warranty. The dealer doesn't. But the dealer will tell yu the world will come to an end if yu don't ABIDE BY THEIR RULES. FUNNY BUT TRUE.

Oil related engine failures is the key here. Never ever seen one using M1 like I do or any syn for that matter. If the UOA says the TBN is still good at 7,8 or 10 K . Solubales and contaminants are within spec etc. Great. that's good enough for me. Too many people waste oil and money. They just don't know better. Not their fault. Ignorance is bliss.

[Jer]

Originally Posted by Marty358

You have no idea how well I maintain my cars or how often I have changed timing belts, because I had one snap on me 17 years ago. So yes, I do change them before their life cycle. But back to the discussion. One of my coworkers had a Matrix that the engine went bad at about 30000 miles. She went to the dealer and they said show us your oil change records. She didn't have them, so they said they wouldn't honor the warranty. She took it to another car dealer and traded it. No oil analysis, and yes I know what it is. It is performed on airplanes all of the time, I just think it is a waste of money for a car.

Of course timing belts are a different story in a zero clearance engine. My Supra can toss a belt and no damage is done so I'm not changing it until it fails or gets very bad. You get my point though. You change your brake pads every how many miles or do you change them when they need changed? What about your rotors? Wiper blades? Tires? Light bulbs? Alternator? Battery? I could go on but you get my point. I don't understand people who ream me for doing the same thing with my engine oil. You don't change out every bulb in the car every 6mos so why should I change out my oil every 3k miles on a naturally aspirated passenger vehicle that sees light duty use? Makes little sense to me too.

[bill dowd]

Both of you have valid ideas Toyota made changes the engines in 2002 to help keep down sludge due to the engine design for the smog system. Another reason sludge builds up in the motor is some people just drive a couple miles a day/week and don't let the engine get hot enough to get out the water/vapor inside the block and this will also build sludge. As far a changing synthetic oil I go 12-15,000 miles on my LS400 lexus and soon as I get out of warranty I will go the same on my 2006 camry. BMW Mercedes Corvett and all the high priced cars costing around 75,000 and more all come with Mobil one or some other synthetic oil and go 15,000 miles between oil changes. It takes about 7-8 miles to get all the vapor out of your block everyday and also to the engine oil to go thru the oil filter once . This information come from different car manufactures I also use mobil one extended which is supposed to go 15,000 miles between oil changes and I also check my oil level every 5,000 miles some cars will consume oil. I also read that dino oil has made improvements to be able to now go 7500 miles this is why Toyota recommends 5,000 miles changes. I put 429,000 miles on a Toyota Cressida using mobil one in everything motor,trans,rear end and power steering and nothing ever wore out in that time.

[Jer]

Why would you bump a thread this old for this?

Originally Posted by bill dowd

As far a changing synthetic oil I go 12-15,000 miles on my LS400 lexus and soon as I get out of warranty I will go the same on my 2006 camry.

Why would you wait for your warranty to expire? Please explain.