New Spark Plugs with Carbon build-up in 1 hour?

[Tutman]

I just got back from the dealer with my Sequoia after a 30K service. I first noticed that the tires hadn't been rotated because the front wheels still have the break dust, and the rear ones don't. Got me wondering. What else didn't they do? The invoice says they rotated the tires.

How about the spark plugs? I looked at the cap over the spark plugs, and they were dusty, and no fingerprints. I touched one and it left an obvious fingerprint. So I pulled one of the plugs out. Either the new plugs got carbon deposits in less than an hour of driving, or they didn't even bother changing them. Invoice clearly states, replaced 8 non-platinum plugs.

Either I've lost my mind, or these plugs didn't get changed. Can anyone confirm that plugs do not get carbon deposits in 1 hour (engine is running smoothly). I want to confirm before raising holy sh** tomorrow.

[dsconstructs]

Originally Posted by joetuttle

I just got back from the dealer with my Sequoia after a 30K service. I first noticed that the tires hadn't been rotated because the front wheels still have the break dust, and the rear ones don't. Got me wondering. What else didn't they do? The invoice says they rotated the tires.

How about the spark plugs? I looked at the cap over the spark plugs, and they were dusty, and no fingerprints. I touched one and it left an obvious fingerprint. So I pulled one of the plugs out. Either the new plugs got carbon deposits in less than an hour of driving, or they didn't even bother changing them. Invoice clearly states, replaced 8 non-platinum plugs.

Either I've lost my mind, or these plugs didn't get changed. Can anyone confirm that plugs do not get carbon deposits in 1 hour (engine is running smoothly). I want to confirm before raising holy sh** tomorrow.

Don't sound right at all, perhaps they got confused on which vehicle they were working on. Think I'd ask them to do the whole 30k service all over again, or at least for the first time

[TaxiDriver]

Originally Posted by dsconstructs

Don't sound right at all, perhaps they got confused on which vehicle they were working on. Think I'd ask them to do the whole 30k service all over again, or at least for the first time

It's time for them to answer some questions. Show them the brake dust wheels and spark plugs.

You know, sometimes I wonder the same thing also whether they do all the work. I haven't done my 30k service yet thoough, but it's coming up. How do I check stuff like differential, tranny oil, brake fluid, coolant?

[thecarguy]

GO raise hell.... after you try nicely to get it done. See if a mistake was made before you cause problems. If they wont do anything tell them your going to the BAR with the proof that you paid for work that wasnt done, that will get them shaking. Expecially point out the fact that the dirt over the plug caps hasnt been moved. Demand your money back and go to a different dealer.

I went for a tire rotation and so on but I had one wheel that didnt have a chrome air cap and it was on the same wheel. I knew somting was amiss before I left the lot and pointed it out.

[akauth]

Originally Posted by joetuttle

I just got back from the dealer with my Sequoia after a 30K service. I first noticed that the tires hadn't been rotated because the front wheels still have the break dust, and the rear ones don't. Got me wondering. What else didn't they do? The invoice says they rotated the tires.

How about the spark plugs? I looked at the cap over the spark plugs, and they were dusty, and no fingerprints. I touched one and it left an obvious fingerprint. So I pulled one of the plugs out. Either the new plugs got carbon deposits in less than an hour of driving, or they didn't even bother changing them. Invoice clearly states, replaced 8 non-platinum plugs.

Either I've lost my mind, or these plugs didn't get changed. Can anyone confirm that plugs do not get carbon deposits in 1 hour (engine is running smoothly). I want to confirm before raising holy sh** tomorrow.

The invoice doesn't necessarily reflect what was done. As soon as you entered the door they created the invoice.

It does reflect what should have been done, not what was done.

When I was having the dealer do my annual services for warrantee reasons I changed the oil with synthetic and didn't have them do it. Guess what, it still showed up on the invoice (full oil change).

Alan

[Tutman]

Originally Posted by akauth

The invoice doesn't necessarily reflect what was done. As soon as you entered the door they created the invoice.

It does reflect what should have been done, not what was done.

When I was having the dealer do my annual services for warrantee reasons I changed the oil with synthetic and didn't have them do it. Guess what, it still showed up on the invoice (full oil change).

Alan

I'll give you that. I know the invoice is what the service advisor sets up, and the service tech works from that.

I can tell the oil was changed. Instead of the tranny drain and fill, I paid for the complete flush. I have no way of knowing if that was done. They should have drained and filled the coolant, but I can't tell for sure they did it. They did replace the air filter. No differential fluid was changed...2WD and the service advisor said it didn't need it until 50K. They did replace the rear passenger axle seal because it was leaking, and replaced the rear brakes because of the leak, all under warranty. I hadn't noticed the problem yet. It must have just started leaking.

What should I ask for? Redo Tranny flush and coolant change, change the plugs (for the first time), and refund me? This will at least cost me 2-3 hours of MY time. Should I speak with the Service Manager, or should I go straight to the dealer owner (who I met when I bought the Sequoia)?

The ironic thing is that I always want to do service to my vehicles and my home myself. The reason is that it is stressful dealing with service people that you HAVE to trust. I haven't found anyone I trust yet to work on my cars or my home, but I just don't have time for everything. My wife is the opposite, and has been on me to be more trustful. I thought I would give it a shot, since this dealer did a real good job on my brake TSB a couple weeks back. This was their shot to start earning my trust, and they TOTALLY blew it.

This Toyota dealer has NO area to watch their technicians work. I would have watched them the whole time. There is a new dealer that is a little further away that has a totally viewable work area. This might be the place for me.

[thecarguy]

if your really suspicious go straight to the bar. They will at no charge (or they used to som in not sure) will check to see if the actuall work was done. YOu can go to a local parts store and purchase a hydrometer for your coolant (they also make them for batteries so make sure you get the right one) and it will tell you life expectantcy of the coolant, thats an easy way to tell if work has or has not been done.

[KLS]

If your ATF is bright red, it might be new and it might be old. No way to tell for sure.

If your coolant has any dirt in the radiator neck or the overflow bottle, maybe it wasn't changed. The hydrometer will show the specific gravity of the coolant, not the remaining life. If the coolant is clean, no way to tell.

For sure, see the owner if you can and complain loudly about the things obviously not done, and ask them to demonstrate to your satisfaction a way you can tell that the other work was actually done. Your ace in the hole is a complaint to your state's auto repair consumer protection office (many states have one), but don't threaten that up front...keep it up your sleeve until you need to play that card, or until you're so mad you want to strangle the sleaze-balls.


Ken

[thecarguy]

but low specific gravity will mean bad cooling qualities as opposed to the high cooling qualities of a coolant sample with a higher specific gravity.

[Bbbutch]

Calmly go back to the same service writer with invoice in hand and tell him you think the service you paid for did not get done. Let him look at your vehicle while you point out the discrepancies.
If he is not all apologies and promises to take care of it right away then contact BAR. BAR will most likely have you take it to another vendor for inspection.

[Tutman]

I've talked with the service manager, and he said that the only thing that would be fair would be for him to change the plugs and rotate the tires, or refund me for that work done. Jerk. He said that he talked to his "Ace" technician who said he thought he rotated the tires. He said they messed up on the plugs, and that the parts weren't even marked on the invoice but the labor was. Regardless, he was obligated to do what he thought was fair, but wouldn't offer me anything for my time, frustration, and future lack of confidence in his shop. I took the refund and headed straight to the General Manager's office to let him know that a customer of 9 years still with two Toyotas, the Service Manager caused them to lose any future business. He said even if I decide not to return for service, he wants me happy. Smart man. I would bet 99% of the customers never check if the service was done.

After looking more closely today, I'm fairly certain everything else was done. The coolant is bright red (I think it was close to dark-red/brown before), the oil is clean, and the transmission fluid is very transparent.

The service manager asked what they could do for me. I was so mad about the Service Manager that I couldn't think straight. He suggested I calm down, think about it, and call him back tomorrow. I guess I would be satisfied with the rest of the service getting reimbursed. It was mostly labor, which couldn't have taken much more than 30 minutes. The only other parts were oil and air filter, antifreeze, oil, and tranny flush kit. Total parts probably cost them $30 bucks. 30 minutes time and $30 bucks isn't too much to ask for. That would give me $240 back. I usually do my own service, because the prices are hilarious, but I've been busy, and thought this once I would take the easy way out. Big mistake. I always do my own service because of the prices and because I just don't trust dealerships. I just confirmed my worst suspicion.

What do you think? Asking too much for my time and aggrevation?

Joe