There is much speculation and rumours surrounding what engines the next Generation Tundra will have.
Well here is mine.
The new 2004 Toyota Prius (hybrid) has 2 engines obviously. The computer determines whether to run them both at the same time, or individually, depending on the factors the wheels face, speed, etc. Here are the following horsepowers of individual engines:
Clearly you see that the electric Engine has excellent low end Torque. I would be a bit curious to see the torque range of this engine, but taking the torque rating at face value, it has a lot of low end torque. And this is just in a car!
I would imagine that the next Tundra may end up possibly having only one engine, and one engine alone. It will have a V8 Hybrid engine, as was mentioned in the news release.
Everybody buys Diesel for the fuel economy and the torque for towing.
But many Diesels require stricter maintenace than gas, they smell, are noisy, and for some this is too much of a pain in the arse to deal with.
If you had a gas-hybrid engine, which the gas engine would be easier to maintain than Diesel, and because it's a hybrid it gets better fuel economy, as well as the fact you have the low end Torque of the electric engine, I must ask, why does Toyota need Diesel? Why does Toyota need to offer any more engine options? Why have a smaller V8 and a bigger V8, when everyone can have one engine that has the fuel economy of the smaller V8, but will have the torque and fuel economoy of a Diesel, and the horsepower of a big V8?
You tell me.
One begs to question how many engines Toyota needs if this Hybrid thing works out.
Everybody buys Diesel for the fuel economy and the torque for towing.
But many Diesels require stricter maintenace than gas, they smell, are noisy, and for some this is too much of a pain in the arse to deal with.
Your impression of diesel's inadequacies is nowhere close to what is currently on the market. IF you set your sight to europe, diesels there are extremely popular and in demand- 1/3rd on the road are diesels, IIRC. THey are offered on the flagship & corporate sedans costing close to $100k as well as the "people's car".
They are not noisy, nor are they smelly, snooty nor anywhere close to being temperamental as compared to the diesels that once came to our land close two decades ago. Modern diesels currently on the market use computers to program the injection, so they are just as reliable, if not more so reliable than gasoline due to diesel's direct injection system. THey are currently no noisier than gas due to advances in body insulation and stiffness. They start up instantly, just like gas, and do away w/ the glow plugs.
It's just unfortunate that in America, the sales demand isn't that large for diesel. THerefore the diesel motor and the many decades of improvements made to them don't come onto our shores. It's all about the $$$$. since the big 3 realize that there's no USA demand, then they have no reason to upgrade their diesels as fiercely as the other mfrs who compete in europe.
Do your search on the internet on diesel engine technology and you should see numerous advantages going for diesel. Try not to use the big 3 as your
benchmark. As we all know too well, they don't make the grade.
The highlander hybrid is slated to have 270 hp (gas 3.3L V6 and electric motor), yet Ive not seen a torque rating. My guess would be anwhere from 300-700 based on prius hp:torque ratings. It will get a combined 28 mpg, which Im not that impressed with. I also though I saw an FTX release video and I dont think there will be a hybrid in the 2006 tundra. Maybe a couple of years after that.
I'll have to disagree with several of your comments here.
Smelly, yes they are. Try sitting behind one in traffic without having your vents closed. Everytime I ride with my wife and we are close to a diesel, she is always quick to point out something "really stinks". She does not know what a diesel is, but she knows they stink.
Noisy, most certainly louder than a conventional gas engine that has not had an exhaust mod. No comparison.
My friend just bought a new Ford diesel. Yes, you still have to wait to start it up. May not have glow plugs, but you have to wait until the light goes out before you start it.
Dirty, yes. Watch a diesel truck start off and you'll see a large black cloud come from that vehicle. Look at the pump at a gas station. Very dirty compared to regular gas pump.
I have a friend that swears diesel are the end all. He is very biased so I don't bother talking about much with him. Ironically, both of his vehicles are gas engines.
[QUOTE=jeddclampette]
They are not noisy, nor are they smelly, snooty nor anywhere close to being temperamental as compared to the diesels that once came to our land close two decades ago. Modern diesels currently on the market use computers to program the injection, so they are just as reliable, if not more so reliable than gasoline due to diesel's direct injection system. THey are currently no noisier than gas due to advances in body insulation and stiffness. They start up instantly, just like gas, and do away w/ the glow plugs.
Diesels are much more refined than they were just a few years ago. They do still smell
like diesels unless they are equipped with a catalytic converter which makes them smell
like they are burning propane rather than fuel oil. They are much quiter but there is no
way they are as quit as a gas engine. Some still use glow plugs...I think the Fords do.
Others have a heater grid in the intake but either way most small light duty diesels still
have wait to start light. They do start much better when cold that the older engines did years ago as long as the fuel is not gelled from the cold. I would probably buy diesel in anything if it was an available option. Why? Better fuel economy, more torque, longer life, cheaper fuel, no ignition system to worry with and great low end power. Most US consumers don't want a diesel, so they are only in large heavy duty
pickups and larger vehicles here where torque and fuel economy are more important.
I don't think this is likely to change unless gas becomes much more expensive and stays that way for years. People here are too pampered to put up with a bit of noise or fumes.
Look at the pump at a gas station. Very dirty compared to regular gas pump.
The reason for the dirty pumps is deisel has oil in it and dirt sticks to it. That is why if you spill it they usually have some absorbant material to clean it up with.
Some of you guys got a little offended, like you already had a diesel in your tundra, at my comments regarding Diesels, and swayed the topic of discussion. Whether you agree with what I think about Diesels or not, I ask you:
1) Do you agree with my speculation that a V8 Hybrid (remember what the word speculation means), with what we know about it now, could compete with a Diesel with respect to what we know of a Diesel engines attributes (high torque, good gas mileage, etc)?
2) Do you think that if Toyota could successfully create a hybrid that offers the best of all worlds (good gas mileage, lots of torque from the electric engine, lots of hp), that they wouldn't need many other engine options, if anymore?
Some of you guys got a little offended, like you already had a diesel in your tundra, at my comments regarding Diesels, and swayed the topic of discussion. Whether you agree with what I think about Diesels or not, I ask you:
1) Do you agree with my speculation that a V8 Hybrid (remember what the word speculation means), with what we know about it now, could compete with a Diesel with respect to what we know of a Diesel engines attributes (high torque, good gas mileage, etc)?
2) Do you think that if Toyota could successfully create a hybrid that offers the best of all worlds (good gas mileage, lots of torque from the electric engine, lots of hp), that they wouldn't need many other engine options, if anymore?
3) Need a hug?
1)yes
2)yes
3)that's ok.
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.... the trucking industry isn't going hybrid anytime soon, so until we run out of oil, you'll just have to deal with that black smoke.
The trucking industry may not be going hybrid, but Toyota is. Also, I still
think when/if Toyota finally builds BIG trucks they will offer HINO diesels.
Who know's?, maybe a hybrid diesel...
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Shite2k - Lets think outside the box here for a second - something I think that some in here seem to be having a problem doing.
Let's say that Toyota tweaked the 4.7 litre V8 and reduced it's emissions and increased it's horsepower and torque. So lets say we could get it up to around 250-260 HP and 325-340 lb. feet of torque. We then gave it an electric engine and made it a hybrid. For the sake of argument, if we give it an electric engine - something that will be more refined than even the current Prius most likely. So lets say we get another 100 HP and 320 lb. feet of torque out of this electric engine.
YOu have an engine with the gas mileage and emissions of a 4.7 litre V8 and would be just slightly over, or probably equal to a V6 as we know that V6's don't neccessarily always get better gas mileage - because they have to work harder to pull the larger truck where as the V8 doesn't work as hard. You then have two torque peaks. One lower peak from the electric engine and one higher peak from the gas engine so you probably have an excellent torque range/curve for towing. With the combined ponies, you have the HP of a Big *** V8. Something that could compete with the Chevy 5.3 and 6.0 engines. Couple this with the good gas milelage which would compete with the diesels, and you why do you need so many engine options? Why do you need to make a million different engines when one, maybe two, could suffice? YOu also forget that Toyota makes very efficient drive trains. And this will also be toyota's claim to fame. I think Toyota should think like the Karate Kid - keep it simple, but do your moves well.
Why have a smaller V8 and a bigger V8, when everyone can have one engine that has the fuel economy of the smaller V8, but will have the torque and fuel economoy of a Diesel, and the horsepower of a big V8?
I for one would welcome a diesel engine in the tundra. I have owned diesels in the past and I absolutely love the mileage, as well as the almost unstoppable torque. as to the smelly exhaust, its no worse than half the jalopies out there that leave a cloud everywhere they go and they are gas engines. the most important thing about diesels is that they are built to be a work horse and do not usually have the infamous "planned obsolessance" built in that gas engines do.
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" i'm not interested in a hybrid. i'm interested in a diesel. "
DITTO , DITTO , DITTO !!!! give it to us toyota -
twin turbo, stright 6 ,intercooled, and i promise i will buy it and build the living hell out of it !!!
I agree with Shite; a hybrid with competitive hp/ft-lb numbers would be a great strategy.
Good for customers who want power. Good for PR, with eco points for the corporation. Good for marketing, with unique technology to shout about. Good for dealers, with no need for diesel inventory/training. Good for mfg., as Shite mentioned, with no need for 31 flavors of gas engines and tooling.
But can Toyota really make a hybrid become a “substitute for cubic inches”?
New Engine speculations
I would rather have a VW's V-10 TDI .
Toyota Diesel Power !!!
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