'05 Tundra, 4.7LV8 - will headers make a difference

[rkelleyrtp]

Greetings all,

Just bought a new '05 Tundra Access Cab Limited Edition (TRD Sports package) 4x2, 4.7L VVTI. Looking to doing some mods for more torque and HP.

While I was at the dealership last week, I spoke with a technician about installing TRD headers and cat-back system. According to the tech, the TRD headers won't provide any noticible difference in torque or HP. In fact, he said the $2000 to get them installed (parts plus labor) would be a big waste of money. He suggested I just put the TRD cat-back system and (possibly) a cold-air intake system.

Just wondering what other folks think about installing headers (TRD or not). If you think the headers are worthwhile, can you give me some suggestions on which brand to purchase. While I don't mind spending some money on performance upgrades, I don't want to spend $2000 foolishly.

Also, how hard is it to install the headers? The tech said it will take 9hrs because the motor must be dismounted from the chassis.

Thanks,

-Ron

[HBjeff]

after doing the research here, dont waste money on any TRD exhaust piece. the header is supposedly not that good, the dual exhaust is bad

[LGL002]

Originally Posted by rkelleyrtp

Greetings all,

Just bought a new '05 Tundra Access Cab Limited Edition (TRD Sports package) 4x2, 4.7L VVTI. Looking to doing some mods for more torque and HP.

While I was at the dealership last week, I spoke with a technician about installing TRD headers and cat-back system. According to the tech, the TRD headers won't provide any noticible difference in torque or HP. In fact, he said the $2000 to get them installed (parts plus labor) would be a big waste of money. He suggested I just put the TRD cat-back system and (possibly) a cold-air intake system.

Just wondering what other folks think about installing headers (TRD or not). If you think the headers are worthwhile, can you give me some suggestions on which brand to purchase. While I don't mind spending some money on performance upgrades, I don't want to spend $2000 foolishly.

Also, how hard is it to install the headers? The tech said it will take 9hrs because the motor must be dismounted from the chassis.

Thanks,

-Ron

Check out the aftermarket forum there are several threads regarding headers, mufflers and etc. Lots of detail info about regular driving and towing.

Larry

[tundrafire]

Nobody will know what kind of difference they will make until someone finally makes them for the 05s.

[tuesdayd]

Originally Posted by tundrafire

Nobody will know what kind of difference they will make until someone finally makes them for the 05s.

Right...they're not out yet. I think JBA is supposed to have something in May/June.

Originally Posted by rkelleyrtp

While I was at the dealership last week, I spoke with a technician about installing TRD headers and cat-back system. According to the tech, the TRD headers won't provide any noticible difference in torque or HP. In fact, he said the $2000 to get them installed (parts plus labor) would be a big waste of money. He suggested I just put the TRD cat-back system and (possibly) a cold-air intake system.
Just wondering what other folks think about installing headers (TRD or not). If you think the headers are worthwhile, can you give me some suggestions on which brand to purchase. While I don't mind spending some money on performance upgrades, I don't want to spend $2000 foolishly.

Also, how hard is it to install the headers? The tech said it will take 9hrs because the motor must be dismounted from the chassis.

Thanks,

-Ron

$2000 to install headers!! That's a bit on the high end. My JBA's were $700 shipped, and others around here have been finding some great deals lately. Nine hours may be the book time, but people who do it for a living can do it much faster. I'd say $300 - $400 for the job is about average, so you're still looking at less than $1100 for JBA's installed. If you've got a really good set of tools (air included), then it's not too bad. If you've got a few wrenches and a hammer laying around then don't even think about it.

[DevinSixtySeven]

traditionally, the guy's comments from the dealership are backwards...the "cold air" intake and cat-back exhaust will usually kill your go, while headers will improve it.

i did read a comment from rockymtnray a while back regarding the 05 exhaust manifolds, they are different from the previous model years, and so is the intake. see if you can find that post.

my uneducated guess is that headers would do for your truck what they did for mine (improve things), but will be more complicated due to the new exhaust manifold, and in addition i'm not sure how closely tied up the exhaust and intake are with the ecu.

unfortunaely, i'm saying i can't help you directly as there are too many new variables with the 05 engine ...but maybe rockymtnray will chime in with some information that might help.

btw it is a lot easier to remove the engine mounts to install headers! that's what he's talking about re separating the engine from the frame.

-sean

[HBjeff]

the intake on the 05 is really nice. i sure wouldnt change it. from the factory its a large straight pipe with an enclosed filter, thats a good thing.

the 05 manifolds have air injection tubes, which really isnt a big prob for the header makers, as headers have been made with them forever, but it means we have to wait for them to be released

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by rkelleyrtp

Greetings all,

Just bought a new '05 Tundra Access Cab Limited Edition (TRD Sports package) 4x2, 4.7L VVTI. Looking to doing some mods for more torque and HP.

While I was at the dealership last week, I spoke with a technician about installing TRD headers and cat-back system. According to the tech, the TRD headers won't provide any noticible difference in torque or HP. In fact, he said the $2000 to get them installed (parts plus labor) would be a big waste of money. He suggested I just put the TRD cat-back system and (possibly) a cold-air intake system.

Just wondering what other folks think about installing headers (TRD or not). If you think the headers are worthwhile, can you give me some suggestions on which brand to purchase. While I don't mind spending some money on performance upgrades, I don't want to spend $2000 foolishly.

Also, how hard is it to install the headers? The tech said it will take 9hrs because the motor must be dismounted from the chassis.

Thanks,

-Ron

First of all the TRD headers won't work on an '05 because they have no accomodation for air injection. TRD headers were designed to fit only the '00 to '02 models...an engine that has a very different torque curve than does an '05. JBA is working on designing headers for '05s but it will be at least another month or so before even those are available.

The TRD headers were difficult to install because they were longer than stock, though I think 9 hours is more a reflection of the incompetence of this particular tech than a problem with the headers themselves. JBA headers (at least those for the '04 and earlier engine) are a direct bolt in and no, the engine does not have to be dismounted. The Master Toyota tech that installed my JBA headers at the dealership had the whole job (both sides) done in a little over 5 hours and the labor charge was only $425. Many folks have only paid $250 to $350 for installs of JBA and similar shorty headers like SS Autochrome.

In any event, on the '00 to '04 engine, headers have been the one and only mod that was guaranteed to improve performance across the RPM range. That the tech you spoke with doesn't grasp this is again a reflection of his incompetence. However, since there is not yet any header for the '05 engine, the effect of header for '05s is still an unknown.

So forget headers for the time being.

It's unknown if an aftermarket intake will help at all since there are none of those for an '05 either...and the stock intake is a cold air intake to begin with. Most of the so-called cold air intakes mostly make a lot of noise and slightly increase top end horsepower at the expense of low end torque. So also forget cold air intakes.

The TRD catback is no longer being sold though there is a dealer option for a "performance dual exhaust", probably made by Borla, that's quite similar to the exhaust once sold under the TRD name. This exhaust does provide some improved top end horsepower but it's notorious for significantly hurting low to mid range torque and a lot of folks think it has a very bad drone problem. Unless you are enthralled with the idea of dual pipes and regularly rev your engine over 4000 RPM and don't mind losing a lot of your acceleration below 3000 RPM, I'd suggest you not install this exhaust.

Quite frankly Toyota has come very, very close to wringing all the torque and power out of your truck's engine that can be gotten out of it. Other than the possible installation of the forthcoming JBA headers and maybe a lower restriction muffler (Magnaflow, Dynomax, Spintech, Gibson...but NOT Flowmaster)...but NOT a catback....almost any "performance mod" you do to your truck will actually reduce its performance. This is not a traditional lazy, underperforming domestic engine that will respond well to simple bolt on mods. It's very easy to screw up the excellent stock performance and very, very hard to improve on it...especially with the exceedingly complex intake and valving system in your truck's engine.

[dezert_rida]

Originally Posted by rkelleyrtp

Greetings all,

Just bought a new '05 Tundra Access Cab Limited Edition (TRD Sports package) 4x2, 4.7L VVTI. Looking to doing some mods for more torque and HP.

While I was at the dealership last week, I spoke with a technician about installing TRD headers and cat-back system. According to the tech, the TRD headers won't provide any noticible difference in torque or HP. In fact, he said the $2000 to get them installed (parts plus labor) would be a big waste of money. He suggested I just put the TRD cat-back system and (possibly) a cold-air intake system.

Just wondering what other folks think about installing headers (TRD or not). If you think the headers are worthwhile, can you give me some suggestions on which brand to purchase. While I don't mind spending some money on performance upgrades, I don't want to spend $2000 foolishly.

Also, how hard is it to install the headers? The tech said it will take 9hrs because the motor must be dismounted from the chassis.

Thanks,

-Ron

Its pretty bad when the Toyota tech is ill informed on the procedure to install parts, and also applications.

The other guys hit the nail on the head. There are no headers available yet. When the JBAs are available, if they are anything like the 04 and older, it will deffinitely be worth it. All you have to do is look at a stock manifold next to a header and it will be apparent.

As far as difficulty to install, we will have to wait and see if the 05 headers will be made to fit to the factory head pipe flanges, or not. That will determine how many home installs will be done. On 04 and older removing engine mounts was uneccessary.

As far as cat backs, theres alot of variables in chosing the right setup. I like it loud,and high HP. If im on the freeway and I need to pass, I want some juice. I tow a car hauler with my prerunner and all camping gear every other month to the desert. I run a 3" system from the Y back and it hauls azz. Everybody has an opinion, choose wisely.

[v8Toilet]

Headers of the right kind like JBA headers make a very noticeable difference in power for the pre 05 I-force so I would imagine it should do the same for the 05. The 05 Tundra has the same restrictive design manifolds as the earlier models. The 4.3-liter Lexus version of this engine makes 300 horsepower @ 5600 rpm and 325 lb ft of torque so I think allot more power can be made from the I-force V8 engine. The 05 I-force has 282 horsepower and 325 lb ft of torque. The Lexus engine makes 70 horsepower per liter and 75.6 lb ft of torque per liter. The 05 Tundra makes 60 and 69 lb ft. My 01 makes 52 horsepower per a liter and 67 lb ft per a liter stock. If the 05 Tundra made what the Lexus variant makes per liter you would have 329 horsepower and 355 lb ft of torque.