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Engine & DrivetrainDiscussions about the engine and drivetrain of your vehicle.
This is a discussion thread titled "diesel engine?", within the Engine & Drivetrain forum, part of the Technical & Vehicle Assistance Forums category.
If the diesel comes,I sure hope it is a lot quieter than the Ford and Dodge Diesels.They are really loud;it would drive me crazy on a long trip.Charlie,New Orleans
Diesel??? This is the first I've heard. Is there some "real" discussion of a diesel for the Tundra? That would be awesome, though I can't imagine selling mine for another 100,000 miles...
New tech injection is supposed to make them quieter
Ryan,you are right,the compression ignition(almost like a big detonation each time) is noisy.I read recently in Popular Science that some sort of "high tech" variation in the injection system is supposed to change the quality of the sound-make it less "rattlely" ,I guess.Very good soundproofing can help a lot also.Listen to a Mercedes,then listen to a Dodge-night and day,and mostly due to soundproofing.You might have to add 100 lbs of soundproofing,but it would be worth it,especially to the driver.
I would consider a diesel,but not in their current,very noisy form-better ones are on the way-they even claim they can get rid of the smell.Luck,Charlie
The reason I would want a diesel is because:
1] lots of torque at low rpm
2] better mileage (about 22-26mpg) as compared to
the current mpg of the 2UZ-FE (4.7L V8) gas.
3] much better water-resistance when crossing
streams and such.
The diesel engines that I would want, ranges from the normally-aspirated 1HZ, tthe turbo-intercooled 1HD-FTE, to the awesome 13B-FT (engine of the www.megacruiser.com).
Anybody want to petition Toyota for the diesel engine?
Re: New tech injection is supposed to make them quieter
Quote:
Originally posted by charlie Ryan,you are right,the compression ignition(almost like a big detonation each time) is noisy.I read recently in Popular Science that some sort of "high tech" variation in the injection system is supposed to change the quality of the sound-make it less "rattlely" ,I guess.Very good soundproofing can help a lot also.Listen to a Mercedes,then listen to a Dodge-night and day,and mostly due to soundproofing.You might have to add 100 lbs of soundproofing,but it would be worth it,especially to the driver.
I would consider a diesel,but not in their current,very noisy form-better ones are on the way-they even claim they can get rid of the smell.Luck,Charlie
GM's Duramax diesel is quieter due to using multiple squirts of fuel during the injection cycle. The engine is an Isuzu design and the injection equipment is from Bosch. The system is "common rail." The fuel is in a high pressure header (rail) and the injection valves are computer controlled to spray fuel directly into each cylinder at the optimum times and amounts. The fuel pressure in the rail is up to 23,000 psi.
"The sophistication and technology of the direct injection system components make the Duramax engine capable of employing a process known as "pilot injection."
"Pilot injection involves injecting a small amount of fuel into the cylinder prior to the main injection event. A complex process in the electronic controls selects the optimal time, duration and quantity of pilot injection, coupled with the main injection charges.
"The result — combustion starts on a smaller scale and builds subtly, but rapidly, for reduced noise/knock, less vibration and quieter and smoother warm-ups." http://www.duramaxdiesel.com/02_bosch/sub03.htm
The reason I would want a diesel is because:
1] lots of torque at low rpm
2] better mileage (about 22-26mpg) as compared to
the current mpg of the 2UZ-FE (4.7L V8) gas.
3] much better water-resistance when crossing
streams and such.
......
Drexx Laggui
Yes, and any diesel engine is more expensive to build, weighs a lot more than a gasoline engine of the same power, and is more expensive to repair. The diesel is also usually longer lived than a gasoline engine because it's built to last longer. That's part of the reason for higher cost and weight. The diesel pays off for folks who drive a heavily loaded truck many, many miles for many years.
A "Fleet sales manager" at a Toyota dealership recently told me that Toyota makes a wide variety of Tundra configurations, including diesel, but not for the US market. He said they are afraid that the big three would run crying to their congressmen.
Personally, I'll replace my Tundra when I can get one with a fuel cell. As a former diesel mechanic, I appreciate the qualities of a diesel, but I wouldn't want one in my personal vehicle. They're fine for boats, ships, big trucks and tractors, but not cars and pickups.
A fuel cell powered vehicle could have much better torque, power, economy, and be much quieter than gas or diesel. Electric motors are extremely good for powering a vehicle, it's the electric storage or generation that's always been the hangup. Most of the major (and some minor) auto manufacturers are close to producing fuel cell powered vehicles which will weight the same or less than gas, occupy reasonable space in the vehicle, and be affordable (though probably somewhat more than a gas engine in the beginning.)
As I understand it, an electric motor could drive an automatic transmission without a torque converter because it is not turning when you are stopped. An electric motor can generate high torque from zero RPM on up. Stomp on the gas and GO. And quietly. I understand that some of the manufacturers have had to put noise makers on their test cars for safety reasons. Pedestrians couldn't hear them coming. I like that. I want my noise maker to sound like those big battle cruiser spaceships on the sci-fi movies - the ones that shouldn't be making any sound because they're in the vacuum of space. No, actually I'd probably try to turn it off.
Originally posted by bgodfrey A "Fleet sales manager" at a Toyota dealership recently told me that Toyota makes a wide variety of Tundra configurations, including diesel, but not for the US market. He said they are afraid that the big three would run crying to their congressmen.
Personally, I'll replace my Tundra when I can get one with a fuel cell. As a former diesel mechanic, I appreciate the qualities of a diesel, but I wouldn't want one in my personal vehicle. They're fine for boats, ships, big trucks and tractors, but not cars and pickups.
A fuel cell powered vehicle could have much better torque, power, economy, and be much quieter than gas or diesel. Electric motors are extremely good for powering a vehicle, it's the electric storage or generation that's always been the hangup. Most of the major (and some minor) auto manufacturers are close to producing fuel cell powered vehicles which will weight the same or less than gas, occupy reasonable space in the vehicle, and be affordable (though probably somewhat more than a gas engine in the beginning.)
As I understand it, an electric motor could drive an automatic transmission without a torque converter because it is not turning when you are stopped. An electric motor can generate high torque from zero RPM on up. Stomp on the gas and GO. And quietly. I understand that some of the manufacturers have had to put noise makers on their test cars for safety reasons. Pedestrians couldn't hear them coming. I like that. I want my noise maker to sound like those big battle cruiser spaceships on the sci-fi movies - the ones that shouldn't be making any sound because they're in the vacuum of space. No, actually I'd probably try to turn it off.
--Brian
wow
this is what i have been thinking for the past couple of months.
keep the tundra until they come out with a hybrid tundra or similar.
ford and gm are suppose to have a hybrid truck out within 2 years. i feel toyota won't be far behind.
from what i hear it will get only about 5 mpg more. but that is better economically than a hybrid small car which gets high gas mileage b4 hybridization.
toyo has a hydrogen fueled 4runner out won't mass produce it account nowhere to fuel it except their own station somewhere out west.
Brian,why wouldn't you like a diesel in your Tundra?I must admit,I am no fan of diesels,despite their slightly better mileage in small(say under 5000 lbs) vehicles.I just couldn't live with that clatter,and the smell doesn't do much for me either.They are generally dog slow also,even the ones that claim good hp ,are very slow revving.The mileage advantage they have in larger vehicles,or towing big trailers>5000 lbs, is significant,but since I never tow more than 1000lbs,it doesn't matter.
My buddy has a 7.1l(I think it is 7.1 liter) Ford 2002 diesel in his 250 Crew cab.He was told he would get 22mpg on the highway with no load,and only0.5mpg less towing a 7000 lbs trailer home.They were half right;he gets just 0.5mpg less,but he gets about 14mpg without towing on the highway.13.5MPG with his 7000 lb trailer.I think someone has posted he gets 9-10 mpg with his V8 Tundra with a similar load.
Why wouldn't you want a Diesel?You are very familiar with them,what are your reasons?Noisy,smelly,or slow?Aren't they more sensitive to oil change intervals(not changing often enough),and poor quality fuel?Thanks,Charlie
Originally posted by charlie ... Why wouldn't you want a Diesel?You are very familiar with them,what are your reasons?Noisy,smelly,or slow?Aren't they more sensitive to oil change intervals(not changing often enough),and poor quality fuel?Thanks,Charlie
You did a pretty good job of summing it up, but you left out "heavy." Heavy means you also need heavier chassis and suspension to carry it which, in turn, means more cost to purchase and maintain the vehicle - tires and shocks wear out faster, etc.
(And I suppose "smelly" is less relevant to the owner than to the person following him/her.)
The reason I would want a diesel is because:
1] lots of torque at low rpm
2] better mileage (about 22-26mpg) as compared to
the current mpg of the 2UZ-FE (4.7L V8) gas.
3] much better water-resistance when crossing
streams and such.
The diesel engines that I would want, ranges from the normally-aspirated 1HZ, tthe turbo-intercooled 1HD-FTE, to the awesome 13B-FT (engine of the www.megacruiser.com).
Anybody want to petition Toyota for the diesel engine?
Drexx Laggui
Why is a diesel engine more water resistant than a gasoline engine?
Originally posted by bgodfrey A "Fleet sales manager" at a Toyota dealership recently told me that Toyota makes a wide variety of Tundra configurations, including diesel, but not for the US market. He said they are afraid that the big three would run crying to their congressmen.
--Brian
I thought Tundra is for North America market only.
Why is a diesel engine more water resistant than a gasoline engine?
It doesn't have spark plugs, therefore no distributor which has vent hole in it that retains water/moisture.
Quote:
Who makes 13B-FT?
I'm sorry, but my original post should have meant "15B-FT". 13B is a weaker engine. Toyota makes those diesel engines.
BTW, I don't think the Tundra's chassis needs to be modified to handle a diesel engine. The weight difference will not be too far from the 2UZ-FE, and after all, it's a Tundra truck. As for the suspension system, I hold the same opinion.
diesel engine?
Hope it is quieter than Ford and Dodge
No, actually I'd probably try to turn it off.
