96/97 LC or LX

[Chicho]

I will be selling my 05 Tundra DC soon and want to replace it with something I can really wheel off road. Judging by the prices, I will probablly be looking at an 96/97 LC or LX. I realize the LX is basically a rebadged LC. Anyone have experience lifting and wheeling the LX? Since they are the same in price, I wouldn't mind having the extra features if they are identical underneath and use the same aftermarket parts to lift. Thanks...

[Blender]

i hate to link you off-site but www.ih8mud.com can't be beat for cruiser tech. Plus the chit-chat section is hilarious. I'm keeping an eye out for a cheap/project 80, but haven't found "the one" yet.

[Chicho]

What a site! Thanks for the info. Questions answered!

[Joe]

Before you jump on the bandwagon of the 80 series cruisers read different forums relative to off-roading. Mud is an excellent forum for technical questions relative to simple (for some quite difficult) maintenance questions and how to do maintenance. There are very few "wheelers" on that site wheeling 80 series, the wheeler’s seem to be using the 40 series and a few 60 series. Most 80 series are grocery getters and quite a few of the 80 series drivers on that site think the 80 is the most “extreme” and greatest off-road vehicle made. It makes for interesting reading and a few good laughs. The 80 series are heavy beasts, require a lot of maintenance, get poor gas mileage, possess marginal ground clearance and are a little underpowered by today’s standards (the V6 inline is very torqueee, which is a good thing). I have a '95 Cruiser built by Slee and it was built for extreme off-road/expedition type wheeling - whatever that means in Cruiser language – my cruiser can go most anywhere my Tundra goes but it does so with “extreme” difficulty compared to the Tundra. I mean the Cruiser really takes a beating and literally plows over obstacles. I’m running 35” tires, lifted 5”, 4:88 gears, ARB lockers and armor everywhere. The front and rear custom bumpers, sliders and skid plates take solid hits, the exhaust gets beat to sh*t, the rear driveshaft often times takes a hit and has to be replaced at $125 a crack. It can’t vertical climb like my Tundra but that is a wheelbase thing. On extreme trails I have to use the winch often compared to very seldom with the Tundra – ground clearance issues there. My personal opinion of the “built” 80 series is they are expensive want-a-bees’. I’ll sell you my ’95 Cruiser with all the extra “maintenance” parts I have for a cool $21K and if you built it today the cost would be well over $28K and you would still have a 20 year old vehicle. (I’ll send pictures of it in action)
Now as a daily driver in adverse weather conditions, the 80 series is an excellent vehicle in my opinion if it has the center diff lock switch (CDL), which greatly improves traction in high range. IMHO, there are few vehicles on the road today that can match or exceed the 80’s safe performance in adverse weather conditions.
If you plan to build the 80 series into a formable off-road vehicle (to climb over rocks and carry you through mud patches) it will cost you an arm and a leg plus your 1st newborn. The same could be said about the cost of "building" the Tundra but you will have a newer vehicle that takes less maintenance, gets better gas mileage, has better ground clearance and is not underpowered.
There are better vehicles on the market that are better off-road capable vehicles that don't cost an arm and a leg to make into extreme trail machines and still keep as a daily driver than the 80 series or the Tundra. The Taco, 4Runner and Jeeps are but a few of them.
If you want to know more, just PM/E-mail me and I’ll answer any questions you have as best as I can.

[firetruck41]

Chico, it sounds like Joe doesn't know what he's talking about, even though it seems he has an 80 series. Go over to IH8MUD.com and check it out for yourself. The prices are reasonable, moderate lifts are cheap, maintenance is simple and if you DIY, not expensive at all, and they are very capable for a wagon.

Here's one of those mall crawlers from 'mud:

[firetruck41]

Here's the pic, hopefully.

[firetruck41]

Here's 20+ pages of pictures of "mall" cruisers, doing things they can't do:
Wild Wheeling pics

[Joe]

Originally Posted by firetruck41

Chico, it sounds like Joe doesn't know what he's talking about, even though it seems he has an 80 series. Go over to IH8MUD.com and check it out for yourself. The prices are reasonable, moderate lifts are cheap, maintenance is simple and if you DIY, not expensive at all, and they are very capable for a wagon.

Here's one of those mall crawlers from 'mud:

I didn’t think my post was that bad – I gave the 80 series credit for trying – it wasn’t designed for the type of terrain we try to traverse with it. It’s too damn heavy, wide and underpowered in stock form to perform well. I wouldn’t even have bothered to answer back if you hadn’t challenged my veracity by stating “even though it seems he has an 80 series.” It’s not seems, I actually have an 80 series and on the net it’s referred to as “Slee’s School Bus”, you know that yellow snorkeled monster Slee built for his testing projects. Damn thing has everything except a kitchen sink in it. The only things it doesn’t have and needs badly are 5:29 gears and a crawler box. A few hard core SAS 4Runner guys refer to it as the “Yellow Lemon”, as I followed them around in it for a few days and took a couple of bruises doing so. It kept up with a little effort but it’s very well built. If that 1st picture you put up is suppose to show the capabilities of the 80 series, then I think you made the point I was trying to convey. With a decent driver I think a Camry could run that picture portion of whatever trail that is. The other Mudd site you posted has a couple good pictures of built 80’s on trails – Christo is attempting a hard climb with his short bus – now that is a very well built “half cruiser” and goes everywhere Christo wants to, either under its own power, winch or tow rope – Christo will get to where ever he intended to go. He’s a hell of a good driver and has a great shop to repair whatever he breaks and he does break a few parts every now and then. Some pictures are poser shots, no doubt as all sites have a few of those – Pirate has several forums and each vehicle type think they are the cat’s meow and post pictures to prove it. Moab wheeling is very different, as slick rock has unbelievable traction and if you have the ground clearance to get over you can usually climb it. There's tons of basically stock vehicles out there running all but the difficult trails and they all make great photos, like Hell's gate etc - very easy but "scary looking" on photos. All I can say is any day wheeling is better than most days working (I would say all work days but payday is pretty hard to beat). A do it yourself kit from Slee for a 6" lift is $2600 - If you possess the skills to put this together it's reasonably priced, if you don't it could get a little expensive. If you build it right the first time there’s nothing cheap about building a cruiser up for “serious” off-road. Maintenance will be a couple hundred plus a year on average providing you do it yourself and have nothing major go wrong. When you say maintenance is simple and not expensive that is a little too simplistic, as a head gasket replacement doesn't cost much if you can do it yourself - if you can't, well then it becomes expensive as is doing the birfs up front every two years - isn't terribly expensive, if you can do it yourself but it’s a $ couple grand at the dealership. Cruisers are very capable in certain environments - more so than most in what I would call scenic trail adventures. When Chicho wrote he wanted to replace his '05 with something he could really wheel off road I took that to mean more than powder puff trails - maybe like moderate to hard trails? That's why I replied like I did but then, if you're an avid Mudd guy (no disrespect intended), I can understand why you posted that picture, site and believe I'm full of BS. We just travel different trails and break our sh*t in different ways. All is good as long as you’re happy with what you got.

[cruiser88]

somebody leads a sheltered life

[cruiser88]

get a 80 there is a billion reasons to own one if your uses are for indeed off-roading IN THE ROCKS

[Matador98]

IMOP, that is retarded.

The 80 will run circles around the Tundra. Now, if you SAS the Tundra, you may have the beginning of a competition, but it's wheelbase is too long IMOP, for hardcore wheeling, especially with not enough weight on the rear end. It is a truck.

Slee's school bus or not (yes, I know the truck), I disagree with you.

[firetruck41]

Joe, your so full of crap it's not even funny. I guess if you believe a Camry can go the same place as Cruiserdan did in that picture, then we are indeed in different worlds, and yours is not reality. I suspect you know that a Camry could not do that, but are you just used to making stuff up or bending the truth to fit your needs. First of all, your 80 series does not have an inline V-6, as you posted, it has an inline 6; your 95 80 series will not become a 20 year old vehicle if you sold it, it would still be just a 12 year old vehicle; a well modified 80 series LC can cost much less than 21k, depending on the users needs; the pics have a lot more than slick rock at moab; the 80 is not big and heavy, as compared to a Tundra, other than an 80 being ~2 inches taller and ~100lbs heavier, the Tundra is bigger (obviously); a 2.5-3" lift is ~$800, a 4" lift is less than $2k, you can go bigger and spend more money if you like; any vehicle used offroad will require a couple hundred dollars a year in maintenance...
An 80 series does not make a good rock buggy, but replacing a Tundra for offroad use? Yeah it can do that, except for the big bed.

[Matador98]

Originally Posted by firetruck41

J inline V-6, as you posted

You beat me to it, the ultimate credibility killer, right there. You don't even full understand the systems you have on your truck.

[Joe]

Originally Posted by Matador98

IMOP, that is retarded.

The 80 will run circles around the Tundra. Now, if you SAS the Tundra, you may have the beginning of a competition, but it's wheelbase is too long IMOP, for hardcore wheeling, especially with not enough weight on the rear end. It is a truck.

Slee's school bus or not (yes, I know the truck), I disagree with you.

That's OK, I should have kept my mouth shut in the first place. Didn't realize firetruck 41 would post on Mudd looking for support and I didn't describe my Tundra. I was just giving my opinion. My Tundra is lifted 6", 3-linked up front, 4-linked rear, Spidertrac 9 (front & rear) housing & tubes, Hi9 3rds, Solid Axle kingpin style front knuckles & C's, ARBs, Marlin Crawler 4.7, 35" Krawlers on TrailReady beadlocks and a few other goodies. It's done the Rubicon twice (everything but the small sluice), Pritchett Canyon (twice) lower proving grounds and most of the other trails around Moab several times over the past years. It's seen a lot of trails, I enjoy wheeling and usually won't take bypasses. I'm really sorry about posting on this particular thread as it has grown into a f*ucked up debacle that was never intended. I was just typing away and thinking inline 6 and typed V6, typed 20 year old vehicle instead of 12 - but then again, I should have just let the cruiser section be and not posted my opinion. Sorry guys and I do apologize for insulting anyone as no disrespect was intended to anyone or any forum and for my opinions if they hurt anyone’s feelings as again I was just trying to give the original poster another view of the 80 series as I see it. firetruck 41 - you are truly one sick a*s and your actions in this matter are immature at best.

[firetruck41]

Originally Posted by Joe

That's OK, I should have kept my mouth shut in the first place. Didn't realize firetruck 41 would post on Mudd looking for support and I didn't describe my Tundra. I was just giving my opinion.

I don't need any support, just thought some mudders would find it funny. I didn't even link it or reference this forum, until requested, then I gave a indirect reference.

I am giving my opinion, just like you were.

firetruck 41 - you are truly one sick a*s and your actions in this matter are immature at best.

Wow, that seems uncalled for! I don't apologize for pointing out facts, and giving references regarding the 80 series, as well as pointing out misinformation in this thread. If you had "kept it real" instead of going over the top with your 80 bashing, I probably wouldn't have even pointed out the errors I saw.