.
Did almost 5 years ((( starting out in USNR (17 y/o) ...... then transferred to USMC while on active duty ))).
Did E-1 to E-4 as a 8404 Navy Corpsman and then O-1 to O-2 as USMC Rotary Wing Pilot. (started out in medevacs, ended up in gunships).
Went to RVN (late 1967 to 1968 from DaNang to DMZ) ... got banged up several times ... finally, medevaced from RVN to Bethesda Naval Hospital (outside Washington, DC).
Got discharged on a "20/30% medical disability" from Bethesda and ... many years later was upgraded to full disability retirement.
Some of the .. very worst & very best days .. of my life .. were in the military.
.
Did almost 5 years ((( starting out in USNR (17 y/o) ...... then transferred to USMC while on active duty ))).
Did E-1 to E-4 as a 8404 Navy Corpsman and then O-1 to O-2 as USMC Rotary Wing Pilot. (started out in medevacs, ended up in gunships).
Went to RVN (late 1967 to 1968 from DaNang to DMZ) ... got banged up several times ... finally, medevaced from RVN to Bethesda Naval Hospital (outside Washington, DC).
Got discharged on a "20/30% medical disability" from Bethesda and ... many years later was upgraded to full disability retirement.
Some of the .. very worst & very best days .. of my life .. were in the military.
.
Did almost 5 years ((( starting out in USNR (17 y/o) ...... then transferred to USMC while on active duty ))).
Did E-1 to E-4 as a 8404 Navy Corpsman and then O-1 to O-2 as USMC Rotary Wing Pilot. (started out in medevacs, ended up in gunships).
Went to RVN (late 1967 to 1968 from DaNang to DMZ) ... got banged up several times ... finally, medevaced from RVN to Bethesda Naval Hospital (outside Washington, DC).
Got discharged on a "20/30% medical disability" from Bethesda and ... many years later was upgraded to full disability retirement.
Some of the .. very worst & very best days .. of my life .. were in the military.
.
Did almost 5 years ((( starting out in USNR (17 y/o) ...... then transferred to USMC while on active duty ))).
Did E-1 to E-4 as a 8404 Navy Corpsman and then O-1 to O-2 as USMC Rotary Wing Pilot. (started out in medevacs, ended up in gunships).
Went to RVN (late 1967 to 1968 from DaNang to DMZ) ... got banged up several times ... finally, medevaced from RVN to Bethesda Naval Hospital (outside Washington, DC).
Got discharged on a "20/30% medical disability" from Bethesda and ... many years later was upgraded to full disability retirement.
Some of the .. very worst & very best days .. of my life .. were in the military.
Thanks for the "welcome back" and "ditto" to you guys too.
I won't go into a lot of details here ... but there are several unanswered questions or situations that I noticed while in the military and after I came home.
(1) When I look back and remember ... that in the military, you would have actually given your life for a complete stranger ... and maybe you did not even know his name.
(2) When the sh!t really hit the fan in RVN ..... (this may sound unpatriotic) ... you did not think of the good ole USA, raising the flag, or freedom for all .............. ..... the only thing that you were thinking of was ... staying alive and keeping your buddies alive.
(4) After the first bad scare ... you were really not afraid of dying ... but you were scared sh!tless of being captured.
(5) I always wondered why a supreme being (if there is a God) would allow someone like me to survive by the skin of my azz, over and over again ...... while someone else's life was taken so quickly.
(6) I have been in therapy for a very long time (15 years civilian + 11 years at VA) and have been trying to sort out all that stuff and it still does not seem real.
Every once in a while I look at old pictures, read through some documents or paperwork to see if that was really me and if that whole mess was just a bad dream. It seems like I am reading stuff on someone else's life, not mine. Go figure ...
Not crazy .. just a case of PTSD and have "compartmentalized a lot of RVN" to the back of my brain.
Sometimes, I feel like that mouse in the movie, The Green Mile, that always survived and outlived all his peers. His punishment was surviving.
By the time I enlisted a majority of Americans hated the war. Many even hated the soldiers. Well, a very active minority, anyway. A lot of us were sons and daughters of the brave WWII vets and grew up listening to their stories. Their generation loathed Hitler, Mussolini, & Hirohito. You know the story. So we, their children, felt an obligation to our country and as Aldo Ray, in The Green Berets, said, “A soldier goes where he’s told to go & fight whom he’s told to fight”.
I was in my first year of college & really had no idea what I wanted to do so I kind of floundered around and completed a year. Every male 18 or older was being drafted so I knew my number was coming up and wanted some say so, at least, in which service I wanted to join. I took all the tests the Air Force required & was eligible to attend electronics school so when my draft notice arrived I signed up. That was in Jan. 1966. I was sent to Lackland AFB in TX & I swear I did not know it got that cold in TX. In a couple of months I was sent to school in MS.
Electronics school was in MS & turned out to be an additional year of boot camp in addition to school. I remember falling out each summer morning, standing in formation with my freshly starched fatigues only to have them drenched with sweat from the heat & humidity by the time they dismissed us. I finally finished & was reassigned to Castle AFB in CA, near Fresno. I spent two years there & had good times & bad. I worked on B-52’s. On the weekend of my 21st birthday as I was set to go celebrate, a plane flew in from DC & an Operational Readiness Inspection(ORI) was called & I got stuck on base working all weekend(Grrrrrrrrrr). I spent two years there & with only one year to go I thought I had lucked out but then the orders came for Viet Nam. At first I was supposed to go to survival school and into some unit I never found out about. I still don’t know what that was about because the paperwork got fouled up. So I got sent back to MS for more electronics training for fighter jets.
My first look at Viet Nam can only be referred to as culture shock. After flying in at Cam Ranh Bay I hopped a flight north to Qui Nhon. It was there I entered the war zone. Sandbags everywhere. Towers with soldiers & machine guns, officers who looked like children, all manner of uniforms & weapons. I had to catch a troop truck, known as a deuce & a half(two & a half ton truck) to get to my destination. We passed bombed out bridges, helicopters firing missiles into hillsides, & two way traffic(all military) headed north & south on Highway 1. I arrived at Phu Cat AFB & entered through the gate guarded by twin towers like the ones I’d seen all along the way.
Life on the air base was relatively easy compared to what the Marines & Army dealt with. A chow hall with hot meals anytime of day, wooden two story barracks with plywood “room” dividers, & a hot water shower stall made for six or so(hard to remember, exactly). We worked radar jamming gear on F-4’s & old Korean War F-100’s. The equipment was new, “solid state” circuit boards, not the heavy vacuum tube stuff on the B-52’s at Castle. It was pretty reliable & if something went bad we did not even have to find which part was bad, just which circuit board, replace that & destroy the malfunctioning one. Because the equipment was so good, guys from my shop were always getting ordered to assist on perimeter patrol at night. You’d get it for a month at a time & I got it three times in the year I was there. Every night the sky was punctured with flares. We had a Korean unit stationed outside the base & they handled patrolling the mountains & shooting off flares from their howitzer. It went off so regularly that when the Vietnamese would fire mortars into the base you had to listen for a minute to tell whether you needed to duck or not. The mortars would “walk” across the base so if the sound you heard was moving, get you a$$ under cover. That usually began around 2:00 in the morning. One night I heard them coming just in time to get on my flack jacket, helmet, then hit the deck because they were so close I did not have time to get to the bunker. We had low, sand filled walls around the barracks so I figured I was safer inside as long as one did not drop through the roof or a window. It turned out to be a good decision because the last one that fell blew up right outside my room, which was by the door to the outside, & a friend of mine who ran for the bunker was killed. I got used to the routine & other than when the mortars fell I can’t say I was scared. They pi$$ed me off one night because they hit our BBQ pit. Once, my first sergeant, and Ken(in the pic of me at the Bob Hope Show), & I took a deuce & a half load of building supplies to the Army guys up at Bon Son to trade them for a crate of steaks, if you can imagine. I even went out with the Army guys on a “Snoopy” Huey. That bird had an ammonia sniffing nose(looking like Snoopy’s) to find enemy soldiers. What was I thinking? Even on perimeter patrol it was mostly boring just staying awake all night & shooting off a slap flare on occasion. The noise in the bush usually turned out to be an animal. We got into one fire fight during the ’69 Tet offensive but I heard the ’68 one was much worse. I finally got nervous in my last couple of weeks waiting for the plane that was to take me back to Cam Rahn Bay & then home. I boarded a commercial jet in Cam Rahn and it made stops in the Philippines, Hawaii, & then McChord AFB in WA. At some point, after departing each base, while we were beginning to relax, a stewardess would leave her seat at the back of the plane and walk toward the front, without notice, & have a can of spray disinfectant in each hand to spray us down like cattle. Once we reached McChord AFB in WA. There was no one there to greet us, no brass band, no acknowledgment we had given a year of our life (or our lives, for some), just another disinfectant spray & a ticket home. I’ve really never talked about it much. I felt my government abandoned us there. I felt they did not have the will to fight to win or admit they were wrong and go home & so we all just tried to survive the place. Instead of feeling proud I feel humiliated. As Guntech said, I will never allow our soldiers to feel that way again. They are asked to give the ultimate sacrifice and deserve our undying support. I hope this wasn’t too long.
Thanks for the "welcome back" and "ditto" to you guys too.
I won't go into a lot of details here ... but there are several unanswered questions or situations that I noticed while in the military and after I came home.
(1) When I look back and remember ... that in the military, you would have actually given your life for a complete stranger ... and maybe you did not even know his name.
(2) When the sh!t really hit the fan in RVN ..... (this may sound unpatriotic) ... you did not think of the good ole USA, raising the flag, or freedom for all .............. ..... the only thing that you were thinking of was ... staying alive and keeping your buddies alive.
(4) After the first bad scare ... you were really not afraid of dying ... but you were scared sh!tless of being captured.
(5) I always wondered why a supreme being (if there is a God) would allow someone like me to survive by the skin of my azz, over and over again ...... while someone else's life was taken so quickly.
(6) I have been in therapy for a very long time (15 years civilian + 11 years at VA) and have been trying to sort out all that stuff and it still does not seem real.
Every once in a while I look at old pictures, read through some documents or paperwork to see if that was really me and if that whole mess was just a bad dream. It seems like I am reading stuff on someone else's life, not mine. Go figure ...
Not crazy .. just a case of PTSD and have "compartmentalized a lot of RVN" to the back of my brain.
Sometimes, I feel like that mouse in the movie, The Green Mile, that always survived and outlived all his peers. His punishment was surviving.
SOS
.
Sorry, but sometimes I have a bad habit of over simplifying things.
#1, #2 and #4 is simply from our "training".
#5 - Age old question that no one will ever be able to answer. It's like asking why these dirt bags with 5 DWIs are still driving around, but if we have one laps of judgment, the courts will slam the he!! out of us. When it comes to "life in general", there's just no rhyme or reason.
#6 and your final comment is , as you pointed out, PTSD. I'm glad to see that you are dealing with it and not just letting it destroy your life.
I also enlisted at 17. I started Active duty in the USMC right after I turned 18. Because I was 17 when I signed up, I never received a draft number or draft card. At the time, I "thought" I was using rational thinking, after all, it made sense to my 17yr old mind. I figured that being 1968, just about everyone was getting drafted. I figured that I could get drafted into the Army for 2 years or enlist in the Marines for 2 years and get a more intense training (thus better chance of survival). They tended to send the Marines into a deeper pile of sh1t, but at 17, I failed to factor that in.
Even though my combat training was very intense and thorough, at that age I was ill equipped to deal with the horrors of the things I saw (and did) on a mental and/or emotional level. I got VERY lucky and was able to "put my head" where it needed to be to get by. Like you said after the first shock, the fear of dying had past. My training kicked in and it became a business. You just do whatever it is you need to do and rely on your training to pull it off.
The real horror for me, was coming home and trying to switch back to "human mode". Once the insanity of what I was doing was over you tend to start to wonder who that person in the RVN was ! It certainly wasn't that happy go lucky jokester that graduated H.S. 2 years ago. Unfortunately I tried to rationalize it. What made that so difficult was the scum bags that would spit at me or call me a murderer and baby killer. There were sooooo many of them, I started to question whether they were right or not. Was I really a monster like they said, because of all the horrible things I've done ????? Were these nightmares (flashbacks) payback ?? Why wouldn't they stop, even though I was back and living a "normal" life for years and years?
Then I remembered how I dealt with it in RVN , so I just put my head where it needed to be to survive. Just surviving, sucks! About 18 years after I returned home, my wife talked me into joining the VVNW (Veterans of the Viet Nam War). I was newly married at the time and my son was about 1 yr.old. The nightmares were almost gone, but when one popped up it would scare her to death. At first I really did NOT like the idea. Too many other's in the same area that have seen and done some of the same things that I have. I just didn't want to dredge all that back up.
This was right around the time the public was starting to accept us. Between the public acceptance and seeing that others have been through the same thing as me, I started to feel better about myself. At first I was ashamed of the things I did and would NEVER admit to being a Viet Nam Vet unless there was no way around it. I felt no pride or patriotism, but all of a sudden things started to turn around for me.
Even though it was the "talking" that helped turn things around for me, I still to this day will not talk about specifics with ANYONE. I think that the MAIN thing that helped was the public acceptance. This is one of the BIG reasons I feel soooo strongly about supporting our men and women that are fighting for us now. I KNOW how hard it is for them to adjust. They need to know that they did nothing wrong. They should be proud of their service to this country and that their sacrifice (and their family's sacrifices) are greatly appreciated.
I can't believe I've said all this. I NEVER tell anyone these things, but it felt good. Sorry for the length.
__________________
07 Tundra DCSB, 5.7, Blue Streak Metallic, 4X4, SR5, TRD, BU, CK, DZ, FE, HM, MG, OF, Brushed Stainless steps, sill protectors, USMC lighted hitch plug and assorted stickers and license plate brackets, rollup bed cover, Rhino Liner, Mesh Grill backing, Black Wheelskin steering wheel cover, Wade in channel vent visors, under rear seat storage, PRG mini spring pack, Proforce rear exit cat-back exhaust, aFe CAI, TRD rear sway bar, A.R.E. MX series Cap.
What made that so difficult was the scum bags that would spit at me or call me a murderer and baby killer.
I never quite understood that.
I was a kid and a young teenager during the Vietnam era, and still a little on the naive side. The draft was still in full swing, and while I might - I say MIGHT - be inclined to understand the peaceniks' POV against those who volunteered for Vietnam, I'm surprised they would hold the same regard for those who were drafted and sent their "against their will."
Of course, back then many people saw the government as "the enemy" and probably associated anyone affiliated with the government (miiltary included) as the bad guys.
One of the reasons I joined the Navy when I just turned 17 in 1970, was to be able to wear the uniform. The Navy warned us not to wear the uniform while on leave, as it would antagonize the protestors and put us in harms way.
I guess Pogo was right when he said, "I have met the enemy, and he is us."
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Benjamin Franklin - "He who shall introduce into public affairs the principles of primitive Christianity will change the face of the world."
George Washington - "It is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the Providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favor."
John Hancock - "Let us humbly commit our righteous cause to the great Lord of the Universe...Let us joyfully leave our concerns in the hands of Him who raises up and puts down the empires and kingdoms of the earth as He pleases."
The Navy warned us not to wear the uniform while on leave, as it would antagonize the protestors and put us in harms way.
At first, we couldn't get the "Military discount" when flying unless we were in uniform. It got so bad though, they asked us NOT to wear them, just use our Military IDs. I was SOOOOOO proud of being a Marine, I proudly wore my uniform anyway and dealt with the a-holes.
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07 Tundra DCSB, 5.7, Blue Streak Metallic, 4X4, SR5, TRD, BU, CK, DZ, FE, HM, MG, OF, Brushed Stainless steps, sill protectors, USMC lighted hitch plug and assorted stickers and license plate brackets, rollup bed cover, Rhino Liner, Mesh Grill backing, Black Wheelskin steering wheel cover, Wade in channel vent visors, under rear seat storage, PRG mini spring pack, Proforce rear exit cat-back exhaust, aFe CAI, TRD rear sway bar, A.R.E. MX series Cap.
*Dear Civilians, ' We know that the current state of affairs in our great nation has many civilians up in arms
and excited to join the military.
For those of you who can ' t join, you can still lend a hand. Here are a few of the areas where we would like
your assistance:*
1. The next time you see any adults talking (or wearing a hat) during the playing of the National Anthem -
kick their ***.
2. When you witness, firsthand, someone burning the American Flag in protest - kick their ***.
3. Regardless of the rank they held while they served, pay the highest amount of respect to all veterans.
If you see anyone doing otherwise, quietly pull them aside and explain how these veterans fought for the
very freedom they bask in every second. Enlighten them on the many sacrifices these veterans made to
make this Nation great. Then hold them down while a disabled veteran kicks their ***.
4. (GUYS) If you were never in the military, DO NOT pretend that you were. Wearing battle dress uniforms
(BDUs) or Jungle Fatigues, telling others that you used to be ' Special Forces. Collecting GI Joe memorabilia,
might have been okay when you were seven years old, now, it will only make you look stupid and get your *** kicked.
5. Next time you come across an *Air Force* member, do not ask them, ' Do you fly a jet? ' Not everyone in the Air Force is a pilot.
Such ignorance deserves an ***-kicking (children are exempt).
6.If you witness someone calling the *US Coast Guard* ' non-military ' , inform them of their mistake - and kick their ***.
7. Next time Old Glory (the US flag) prances by during a parade, get on your damn feet and pay homage to her
by placing your hand over your heart. Quietly thank the military member or veteran lucky enough to be carrying her -
of course, failure to do either of those could earn you a severe ***-kicking.
8. Don't try to discuss politics with a military member or veteran. We are Americans, and we all bleed the same,
regardless of our party affiliation. Our Chain of Command is to include our Commander-In-Chief (CinC).
The President (for those who didn't know) is our CinC Regardless of political party. We have no inside track
on what happens inside those big important buildings where all those representatives meet All we know is
That when those civilian representatives screw up the situation, they call upon the military to go straighten it
out. If you keep asking us the same stupid questions repeatedly, you will get your *** kicked.
9. ' Your mama wears combat boots ' never made sense to me - stop saying it! If she did, she would
most likely be a vet and therefore would kick your ***!
10. Bin Laden and the Taliban are not Communists, so stop saying ' Let's go kill those Commies!
'And stop asking us where he is! Crystal balls are not standard issue in the military. That reminds me - if you see anyone calling those
damn psychic phone numbers, let me know, so I can go kick their ***!
11. ' Flyboy ' (*Air Force*), ' Jarhead ' (*Marines),* ' Grunt ' (*Army*), 'Squid ' (*Navy*), ' Puddle Jumpers ' (*Coast Guard*), etc.,
are terms of endearment we use describing each other... Unless you are a service member or vet, you have not
earned the right to use them. Using them could get your *** kicked.
12. Last, but not least, whether or not you become a member of the military, support our troops and their families.
Every Thanksgiving and religious holiday that you enjoy with family and friends, please remember that there are literally
thousands of soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen far from home wishing; they could be with their families...
Thank God for our military and the sacrifices they make every day. Without them, our Country would get it's *** kicked...
'It's the Veteran, not the reporter, who has given us the freedom of the press. '
'It's the Veteran, not the poet, who has given us the freedom of speech. '
'It's the Veteran, not the community organizer, who gives us the freedom to demonstrate. '
'It's the Military who salutes the flag, who serves beneath the flag, and whose coffin is draped by
the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag. '
* AND ONE MORE:
13. If you ever see anyone singing the national anthem in Spanish - KICK THEIR ***.
ONE LAST THING:
WE LIVE IN THE LAND OF THE FREE, ONLY BECAUSE OF THE BRAVE!
IN GOD WE TRUST.
__________________
07 Tundra DCSB, 5.7, Blue Streak Metallic, 4X4, SR5, TRD, BU, CK, DZ, FE, HM, MG, OF, Brushed Stainless steps, sill protectors, USMC lighted hitch plug and assorted stickers and license plate brackets, rollup bed cover, Rhino Liner, Mesh Grill backing, Black Wheelskin steering wheel cover, Wade in channel vent visors, under rear seat storage, PRG mini spring pack, Proforce rear exit cat-back exhaust, aFe CAI, TRD rear sway bar, A.R.E. MX series Cap.
Hey whats up guys. I just bought a tundra about a month ago and i just recently registered here. I'm still getting around to checking out all of the forums. Anyway id just like to say hello. I'm actually currently serving with 1st brigade 10th Mountain Division. We just redeployed from Kirkuk Iraq on a 15 month deployment. I landed in October because my dumbass was on the reenlistment flight while the rest of the guys landed shortly after in early November. Anyway thanks for what all you older guys did. If you didn't do what you guys did there may not have been the opportunity for me to serve today. Thanks again!
Re: The Military Veterans Thread
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