2000 echo check engine light - Page 2

majdmd · #16 (**permalink**) 08-30-2006, 12:06 AM

hello to the other members

mustang67408 · #17 (**permalink**) 08-30-2006, 01:25 AM

Hello, and welcome.

majdmd · #18 (**permalink**) 08-30-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siriusarcher

Howdy
My first post here...
Thought I'd share what I've learned recently about the fuel delivery system in this car: Had the check engine light, with poor idling, poor acceleration (bogging when I hit accelerator), and occasional stalling at idle, which is a huge safety issue given the vacuum assist brakes and power steering.

Brought to my mechanic who found the p0172 (rich on fuel mixture). He diagnosed a failed O2 sensor, which was replaced, to no effect. After that, he recommended a new throttle body assembly thinking that the idle motor or throttle position sensor was pooched. These can't be fixed--gotta replace the whole TBA. I went to dealership, bought and installed the part, reset EFI, all to no effect. Finally, on a whim, I pulled the mass air flow sensor out (small philips screwdriver needed), cleaned it with a thimbleful of rubbing alcohol, a q-tip and shot of compressed air. Re-installed and reset compter (pulled EFI fuse B). Voila! problem solved! No bogging, better mileage, no stalling. Could have saved about $700 if I had tried that earlier. Consequently, I've got a perfectly good throttle body assembly sitting on my work bench. Anyone with similar experience?

I think car makers enjoy more sensors in the name of cleaner air. Everytime a sensor is dirty they run up a big service bill on the consumer. I just did the Q-tip method and found a thin black layer completely covering the MAF sensors (two tiny parallel sensors). Worse yet I found few filaments hanging on the two tiny sensors ( must have detached from the genuine Toyota air filter that is made of those filaments). I think Toyota should put it in the manual that first thing is to clean the MAF as it will definitley get dirty from the years of exposure to other cars exhaust.

Proost · #19 (**permalink**) 09-19-2006, 07:38 PM

Fantastic!! Great board - just joined. Got the check engine light this past week just before I started a trip from AZ to ME in my 2002 Echo (60K miles - 45K in the last year alone). Took the car into Toyota right away and they said that the code was an "idle control sensor" issue. But, they also said that everything appeared fine. They reset it and it didn't come on for my trip. After about a week here in Maine, the car was running great until this past Saturday when the light came back on and I noticed the idling was getting a bit rough. Totally unfraid of getting my hands dirty, I figured I should check online and see if it's and easy fix. Because of this board, I'll clean the MAF sensor this week and see what happens. A couple of questions:
- where can I go to get the code read besides a dealer?
- how do I reset the computer? I was a bit confused by the past few posts. I saw mention of pulling the EFI fuse. Is that what it takes?

Thanks again and look forward to sharing my info. It's a great car and even though I don't have cruise control, it was an easy ride each of the five times I crossed this great country of ours. It ain't sexy but it's economical, cheap, and roomy.

Proost

mustang67408 · #20 (**permalink**) 09-19-2006, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proost

Fantastic!! Great board - just joined. Got the check engine light this past week just before I started a trip from AZ to ME in my 2002 Echo (60K miles - 45K in the last year alone). Took the car into Toyota right away and they said that the code was an "idle control sensor" issue. But, they also said that everything appeared fine. They reset it and it didn't come on for my trip. After about a week here in Maine, the car was running great until this past Saturday when the light came back on and I noticed the idling was getting a bit rough. Totally unfraid of getting my hands dirty, I figured I should check online and see if it's and easy fix. Because of this board, I'll clean the MAF sensor this week and see what happens. A couple of questions:
- where can I go to get the code read besides a dealer?
- how do I reset the computer? I was a bit confused by the past few posts. I saw mention of pulling the EFI fuse. Is that what it takes?
Most of the big namke auto parts stores will read your codes for free.
Thanks again and look forward to sharing my info. It's a great car and even though I don't have cruise control, it was an easy ride each of the five times I crossed this great country of ours. It ain't sexy but it's economical, cheap, and roomy.

Proost

Most of the big name auto parts stores will read your codes for free. JUST DONT LISTEN TO WHAT THEY SAY FOR DIAGNOSIS, WRITE THE CODE # DOWN.
99% of the time they are wrong in guessing whats wrong.
Removing the EFI on OLDER VEHICLES WORKS (pre 1992)
YOU NEED A SCAN TOOL OR REMOVE THE BATTERY for a minute or so, you will loose your radio stations tho.

Please post the code when you get it , not the descripition. The description can be decieving to those who dont know toyotas.

Most people replace the 02 sensor for a P0171 lean code, and they are far from the problem, most of the time. Hope you understand, not trying to be bossy, just eliminate the room for error in diagnosis.
keep us posted

Proost · #21 (**permalink**) 09-20-2006, 06:54 AM

Thanks Mustang...will do. There's a Car Quest near by...I'll give it a shot.

Got it on the 02 sensor issue. I got that through the thread. Lots of folks were pointed to a sensor problem when that wasn't the case.

Appreciate the help and I'll see what I can get here locally.

Proost

Proost · #22 (**permalink**) 09-24-2006, 03:27 PM

Mustang - read the code today (thanks Autozone): P0505 on my 2002 5-speed Echo. Idle control system. Any thoughts on the best way to troubleshoot? I can push this off and build another thread in the right place if that's appropriate.

mustang67408 · #23 (**permalink**) 09-24-2006, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proost

Mustang - read the code today (thanks Autozone): P0505 on my 2002 5-speed Echo. Idle control system. Any thoughts on the best way to troubleshoot? I can push this off and build another thread in the right place if that's appropriate.

Start with this PDF
It sounds like the IAC Motor or an ECU

medic11492 · #24 (**permalink**) 10-24-2006, 12:37 PM

[I would drive it farther 100 mils or so and see if the engine relearns things. The lean running froma dirty MAF sensor may have it out of calibration and it takes some time for the computer to relearn after you cleared the code.[/quote]

My first post: First of all, THANK YOU Mustang for your wealth of knowledge and your willingness to share it. I too was experiencing the same problems with my 2000 Echo as described in this thread, and not being mechanical at all, usually rely on mechanics to diagnose and repair the problems (very few problems with both of my Toyota's) . I changed the air filter and cleaned the MAF sensor , dissconnected the battery to clear the code, which was lean fuel/air ratio, and that day took it out on the highway. At first the engine hesitated approx every 3 secs, thought I really screwed it up!!! This went on for about 30 mins when all of a sudden it began working perfect, no hesitation, much more throttle response. It has been about 2 weeks since this occurred, no further problems, no check engine lights, better fuel mileage, very pleased!!!!!
Thanks again

evanstolze · #25 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siriusarcher

Howdy
My first post here...
Thought I'd share what I've learned recently about the fuel delivery system in this car: Had the check engine light, with poor idling, poor acceleration (bogging when I hit accelerator), and occasional stalling at idle, which is a huge safety issue given the vacuum assist brakes and power steering.

Brought to my mechanic who found the p0172 (rich on fuel mixture). He diagnosed a failed O2 sensor, which was replaced, to no effect. After that, he recommended a new throttle body assembly thinking that the idle motor or throttle position sensor was pooched. These can't be fixed--gotta replace the whole TBA. I went to dealership, bought and installed the part, reset EFI, all to no effect. Finally, on a whim, I pulled the mass air flow sensor out (small philips screwdriver needed), cleaned it with a thimbleful of rubbing alcohol, a q-tip and shot of compressed air. Re-installed and reset compter (pulled EFI fuse B). Voila! problem solved! No bogging, better mileage, no stalling. Could have saved about $700 if I had tried that earlier. Consequently, I've got a perfectly good throttle body assembly sitting on my work bench. Anyone with similar experience?

I'm having a similiar problem, and have now removed, cleaned, and replaced the MAF. Where do I find EFI fuse B so I can reset the computer and clear the code (the check engine light is still on)?

Thanks for your help.

mustang67408 · #26 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 03:45 PM

ECU Left side Under the drivers side dash

evanstolze · #27 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 09:51 PM

Thank you. Unfortunately, after cleaning and reinstalling the MAF, the problem is now worse. Previously, the car had almost no noticeable driveability problems (slight hestitation on acceleration when the engine was cold). The only issue was the check engine light would not stay off (I had it cleared twice by a dealer, and each time the code read something like " lean on bank 1 " ).

Now, the light is on, and the engine cuts out and shudders badly when you apply the gas. If I baby the throttle, I can drive the car.

Any ideas? I don't see how I could have done something wrong with the MAF...

The check engine light initially came on immediately after filling up at a station that had run out of gas. I had to wait for a tanker to top up the tanks before I filled up. This was several tanks ago. When I took the car in, the dealer suggest replacing the fuel filter, and if the light did not go off, the Oxygen censor, but I have the impression he was guessing.

Thanks again for your help.

mustang67408 · #28 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evanstolze

Thank you. Unfortunately, after cleaning and reinstalling the MAF, the problem is now worse. Previously, the car had almost no noticeable driveability problems (slight hestitation on acceleration when the engine was cold). The only issue was the check engine light would not stay off (I had it cleared twice by a dealer, and each time the code read something like " lean on bank 1 " ).

Now, the light is on, and the engine cuts out and shudders badly when you apply the gas. If I baby the throttle, I can drive the car.

Any ideas? I don't see how I could have done something wrong with the MAF...

The check engine light initially came on immediately after filling up at a station that had run out of gas. I had to wait for a tanker to top up the tanks before I filled up. This was several tanks ago. When I took the car in, the dealer suggest replacing the fuel filter, and if the light did not go off, the Oxygen censor, but I have the impression he was guessing.

Thanks again for your help.

Personally I would drain the fuel tank, change the fuel fileter and flush the lines.
Waiting for a tanker is not a good idea, all the CRUD in the tanks settles to the bottom and when the tanker fills the tanks, all that CRUD gets mixed into the fuel and is pumped into your tank.
NEVER GET FUEL FROM A STATION THAT IS FILLING ITS TANKS. You have to wait a few days for that CRUD to settle. I always tell people to learn the gas stations habits of when they get fuel.
The only real way to hurt the MAF is if you use an aerosol can and spray it point blank, sometime the resistor for the AIR INTAKE TEMP gets broken.
Without me having a fuel sample,or scan tool readings, thats my best GUESS.

evanstolze · #29 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 10:22 PM

Thanks Mustang, I had a feeling you were going to say that......lesson learned. I also suspect I may have damaged the MAF - I did exactly the wrong thing (thinking I was being thorough), and sprayed cleaner from an aersol directly into the MAF.

mustang67408 · #30 (**permalink**) 10-30-2006, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evanstolze

Thanks Mustang, I had a feeling you were going to say that......lesson learned. I also suspect I may have damaged the MAF - I did exactly the wrong thing (thinking I was being thorough), and sprayed cleaner from an aersol directly into the MAF.

Usually people dry them with compressed air and that usually ruins them.
I would try draining the fuel and changing the filter and flushing the lines then replace the MAF if it still throws a P0171 code.
Do NOT USE E-85 fuel either.