You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
Pricing and DealersDiscussions that are specific to vehicle pricing, preferred dealer pricing, current incentives, rebates, and experiences.
This is a discussion thread titled "U.S. vs. Canadian new car prices", within the Pricing and Dealers forum, part of the Marketplace Forums category.
Interesting topic. I've been researching this for awhile as I'm looking at the 08 Tundra. As stated earlier there is a huge price difference. What many manufacturers are doing, including Toyota is not authorizing their dealers to sell to Canadians. Of course there are a few ways of getting around this. Easiest is check out ebay or find a dealer that will sell. Next is have a fellow American buy the vehicle then buy it from them.
I'm still waiting for someone to start the law suits against the manufacturers as this has to be a NAFTA violation. As for importing to Canada, once you have the ability to purchase one, it is quite easy and there are few things that need to be done. Just make sure you get one with Daytime running lights. The odometers aren't an issue as they are displayed in both. Of course you could have that changed once you bring it to Canada. I know of a few folks who have imported vehicles.
Well, I stand corrected, seems the internet is useful for gaining info on other things besides Toyota automobiles and pics of Angelina Jolle' ,. Am I still correct in assumeing that the US vehiles would have to be converted to read in Metric (particularily the odometer)? I know this was the case when I worked for a Chrysler dealer years ago. At that time they also required a DRL to be installed as well before the car/truck could be registered.
I do however still stand by my statement that no matter how much tax our government manages to squeeze from you, they will no doubt do foolish things with it.
What Lator says is correct. If the odometer does not have Miles or Kilometres shown beside it, then a little stick-on label is added by Canadian Tire to indicate that it is in miles. All speedos come in both the miles & kilos format so there is nothing to be done there.
The R.I.V. Program has Canadian Tire do the vehicle inspections. Next time your at Canadian Tire go to the service desk and ask about importing vehicles to Canada. I am sure they will put your mind at ease. In regard to Daylight Running Lamps, I understand Canadian Tire does that installation and it apparently does not cost much. Myself, my '08 Tundra is a factory order so had the $40.00 Daylight Running Light option added at the factory.
Any vehicles not made in Canada, U.S.A. or Mexico are subject to a 6.1% duty added in addition to the GST/PST. Even that isn't much considering what is still saved.
ok, so I have read what you need to do to get into the country, but what are dealers in the US saying you need to do to buy it from them? Is the story different depending on the dealer?
__________________
Cory Ellerbee
Truck Manager/Internet Sales Manager
San Francisco Toyota
(415) 395-6364 or corye@sftoyota.com
ok, so I have read what you need to do to get into the country, but what are dealers in the US saying you need to do to buy it from them? Is the story different depending on the dealer?
I had U.S. Toyota dealers close to the Canadian border that they can not sell to Canadians. However, one can easily find dealers in the southern U.S. that will sell. Some dealers close to the border say that it has to go through a third party, (ie; a person in U.S. buys vehicle, then sells to you).
IMO, dealers that are abiding by Toyota's instructions not to sell to Canadians are just as liable as Toyota is in regard to breaking the NAFTA rules. There is a presently a class action lawsuit launched in Canada that includes auto manufacturers that have made U.S. dealers not sell to Canadians.
I typically am not one to get worked up about things but this is getting rediculous.....
I think everyone should quit crying.... Being a salesman at a Toyota dealership I see a lot of people trying to buy new Toyota's in the US and being shut down by the dealers, it has nothing to do with NAFTA, it has to do with vehicles being built for a specific market and Toyota making sure they stay in that market, at least as new vehicle sales (used who cares do what you want with your own vehicle). Toyotas built in for the US are simalar but not identical to the vehicles built for the Canadian market....don't believe me??? take a look at a lot of part numbers they are different in the US and Canada. For example, someone had an accident with a Rav4 they bought in the US and are trying to get it fixed at our body shop, we can't get some of the parts here in Canada required to fix that vehicle.
On another note, 5 years ago things were exactly the opposite with the Americans coming up here to buy a lot of the higher end vehicles as they stood to save a pile of money no one was complaining about being able to buy a new Sequoia LTD back then, drive it for 6 months and sell it for what they paid new.
All I can say is for all you Canadians who are going to the US to buy vehicles please let the rest of us know what it is that you do for a living be it sell electronics, build cabinets, etc. etc..... so that we can be sure that we go to the US to buy those products too rather than support our own economy. It affects every aspect of our economy, not just those of you looking to buy a new vehiclle....what about those of us selling them? You don't hear me complaining about the people who do decide to go to the US to buy vehicles, just don't come crying to me when you have problems and can't get parts...too bad soo sad!!!
I could go on and on but I have said enough. In the end, what goes around comes around!!! Simple as that.
kdmiller, I see you are in Steinbach MB. I am guessing you being so close to the border are seeing alot of sales go South on you....literally.
I am one of the many many Canadians buying a vehicle from a USA, and saved alot of money by doing it.
I work at a coal mine, and if you don't want to support the company i work for i am OK with that, turn out all your lites, unplug all your appliances. We supply coal directly to a power plant.
If you don't see what is happening with the world market, for example, the one selling tool i think everyone is aware of. It is this little thing called ebay.....ever hear of it? Have you ever purchased anything on it? Have you ever purchased anything from an US mail order Company or clearing house? If you haven't, my friend, well you have been over charged on many an item purchased.
With this marvelous tool called the internet, people from all over the world are able to buy sell or trade items at a fair price.
I guess in a round about way, i am asking you, why is a very very similarly equipped vehicle priced over $12,000 lower in the USA, than it is in Canada?
In my opinion, manufacturers will charge you what ever the market will bear. If manufacturers will not step up to the plate and make some pricing changes, you will see more and more vehicles coming North.
The bad part is, our prices will drop some, but the MSRP on American items will go up.
I look forward to your reply.
Steve
Last edited by Big Steve 63; 10-14-2007 at 03:45 PM.
You made a smart move. I am doing the same thing and picking up my '08 Tundra in November. The nice thing about it is not only are you saving several thousand dollars, but also you are not paying the extra GST/PST on those several thousands you save! A win/win situation.
This is not the dealers screwing Canadians, it is the auto manufacturers collectively. And I think it should and will end up being the dealers screaming at the manufacturers to get Canadian prices down because of lost sales to the U.S. I leave the dealers to resolve the matter themselves. In the meantime I am going where I can find the best price.
Stuball
I am interested in the fact that you are picking up a 2008 Tundra from the US in November. We purchased a 2008 Corolla from the US in August (we made a bad assumption that if 2007's were admissible, then 2008's would not be a problem) and have still not been able to get it registered in Canada. Toyota has not updated the RIV list. RIV tells us we can get it registered if we can get a letter of admissibility from Toyota. At this time we have no idea how to get one. If you are planning on picking up your vehicle in November, have you gotten such a letter and if so, where did you get it? RIV tells us that Toyota was supposed to have updated the list by Oct 1, 2008 and still has not done so.
I had U.S. Toyota dealers close to the Canadian border that they can not sell to Canadians. However, one can easily find dealers in the southern U.S. that will sell. Some dealers close to the border say that it has to go through a third party, (ie; a person in U.S. buys vehicle, then sells to you).
IMO, dealers that are abiding by Toyota's instructions not to sell to Canadians are just as liable as Toyota is in regard to breaking the NAFTA rules. There is a presently a class action lawsuit launched in Canada that includes auto manufacturers that have made U.S. dealers not sell to Canadians.
Stuball
What I think you are finding is that dealers near the border know the law and dealers down south dont because they dont run into it as much. Those southern dealerships will find out the hard way for pissing Toyota off. No car deal is worth pissing Toyota off. Thus the other dealers follow the rules. I can sell you a truck but you have to do certain things to have that happen. I hope for your sake it turns out for the better. But I wouldnt be surprised if it didnt.
good luck and let us know how it turns out once you have it fully titled and registered in Canada. I would be curious to find out how long that takes
and an imo, I dont think nafta has anything to do with it
__________________
Cory Ellerbee
Truck Manager/Internet Sales Manager
San Francisco Toyota
(415) 395-6364 or corye@sftoyota.com
Last edited by SFTundraMan; 10-16-2007 at 04:04 PM.
kdmiller, I see you are in Steinbach MB. I am guessing you being so close to the border are seeing alot of sales go South on you....literally.
I am one of the many many Canadians buying a vehicle from a USA, and saved alot of money by doing it.
I work at a coal mine, and if you don't want to support the company i work for i am OK with that, turn out all your lites, unplug all your appliances. We supply coal directly to a power plant.
If you don't see what is happening with the world market, for example, the one selling tool i think everyone is aware of. It is this little thing called ebay.....ever hear of it? Have you ever purchased anything on it? Have you ever purchased anything from an US mail order Company or clearing house? If you haven't, my friend, well you have been over charged on many an item purchased.
With this marvelous tool called the internet, people from all over the world are able to buy sell or trade items at a fair price.
I guess in a round about way, i am asking you, why is a very very similarly equipped vehicle priced over $12,000 lower in the USA, than it is in Canada?
In my opinion, manufacturers will charge you what ever the market will bear. If manufacturers will not step up to the plate and make some pricing changes, you will see more and more vehicles coming North.
The bad part is, our prices will drop some, but the MSRP on American items will go up.
I look forward to your reply.
Steve
I was not out to get in a pi$$ing match with someone who just wants to be a smart a$$. No prices will ever keep up with the fluctuation on the $ so there is really no sense in whining about it. A year ago when you took in to consideration the value of the $ there wasn't much, if any, difference on simalarily equipped vehicles, and 5+ years ago it was, as I mentioned, the other way around and Toyota put a stop to it at that time as well. As for fair price.... that is simply the amount at which both the selling party and the buying party agree to make a deal. As for buying on ebay, sure I have, but not because I was saving money, but rather because I could not find what I was looking for here. At any rate, I just don't understand why people whine and complain about things they can do nothing about (like gas prices...lol) it is a waste of energy!
Maybe I am just different than most, I wouldn't bother with the hassel unless I couldn't get what I wanted here.
I am interested in the fact that you are picking up a 2008 Tundra from the US in November. We purchased a 2008 Corolla from the US in August (we made a bad assumption that if 2007's were admissible, then 2008's would not be a problem) and have still not been able to get it registered in Canada. Toyota has not updated the RIV list. RIV tells us we can get it registered if we can get a letter of admissibility from Toyota. At this time we have no idea how to get one. If you are planning on picking up your vehicle in November, have you gotten such a letter and if so, where did you get it? RIV tells us that Toyota was supposed to have updated the list by Oct 1, 2008 and still has not done so.
Or send correspondence to:
Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A., Inc.
19001 South Western Ave.
Dept. WC11
Torrance, CA 90501
I don't know if their toll free number would work in Canada but you could try.
Have you asked your dealer if he can get the admissibility info for you. I would think he have access to it. You might even be able to get the information from Toyota Canada's website:
What I think you are finding is that dealers near the border know the law and dealers down south dont because they dont run into it as much. Those southern dealerships will find out the hard way for pissing Toyota off. No car deal is worth pissing Toyota off. Thus the other dealers follow the rules. I can sell you a truck but you have to do certain things to have that happen. I hope for your sake it turns out for the better. But I wouldnt be surprised if it didnt.
good luck and let us know how it turns out once you have it fully titled and registered in Canada. I would be curious to find out how long that takes
and an imo, I dont think nafta has anything to do with it
NAFTA has everything to do with it. The Free Trade Agreement does not only apply to big corporations; it was intended for everybody including individual citizens. And Toyota having U.S. dealers sign agreements not to sell to Canadians is illegal under NAFTA. There is a class-action lawsuit presently being launched in Canada against several auto manufacturers for the prices they are charging Canadians. I have attached it below:
Lawsuit accuses car industry of inflating prices 26/09/2007 1:29:01 PM
A class-action lawsuit launched in Toronto accuses major automakers and dealers of violating competition and consumer protection laws by conspiring to artificially inflate car prices in Canada.
Ontario Superior Court of Justice
Juroviesky and Ricci LLP have filed the suit in Ontario Superior Court.
Lawyer Henry Juroviesky told CTV.ca on Wednesday that prices are being inflated by automakers that tell U.S. dealers not to sell to Canadians.
"They dissuade and threaten their dealers from selling...(Canadians) cars," said Juroviesky.
"What that does is artificially inflate the prices of cars in Canada -- it does not allow the prices to fall to their natural level."
Juroviesky denounced dealer tactics, such as voiding warranties, used to stop cross-border shoppers.
"If a car in Canada is sold for $35,000, and you could go to Buffalo, New York and buy it for $25,000, then according to the natural rules of competition the price in Canada should fall to avoid you from going to Buffalo," said Juroviesky.
He said transportation costs should be the only add-on for cars sold in Canada.
Juroviesky said he got involved in the lawsuit after working with a company that helps Canadian auto dealers go to the U.S. to finance cars.
"The dealers came back and said 'We cannot get our hands on new cars,'" he said. "We started investigating why and we saw that the auto manufacturers have put these impediments in front of Canadians to... keep their prices higher."
Dealers in the past have used the large gap between the Canadian dollar and U.S. greenback to justify the higher prices in Canada, said Juroviesky.
"Now that the dollar is at parity they can't use that cloud... to mask what they're doing," he said. U.S. lawsuits
Meanwhile, class-action suits in the U.S. -- launched in 2003 against automakers and dealer organizations -- are currently being heard in a court in Maine.
The lawsuits -- which came at a time when the Canadian dollar was valued in the 65-cent US range -- were launched after Americans crossing the border to buy cars were denied warranty coverage.
The lawsuits argue that the failure to honour warranties denied Americans the benefits of lower prices.
Juroviesky said it will take about nine months to find out if the lawsuit his firm filed will be certified. If it is, the lawsuit will include all people that bought or leased cars in Canada from 2005 to 2007.
The statement of claim names as defendants:
General Motors Corp., General Motors of Canada Ltd., American Honda Motor Co. Inc., Honda Canada Inc., Chrysler Canada Inc., Chrysler LLC, Nissan North America Inc., Nissan Canada Inc., along with the Canadian Automobile Dealers Association and the National Automobile Dealers Association in the United States.
The firm also plans to add Toyota and Ford, including their Canadian units, once it has signed up representative plaintiffs for each one.
Still, a recent study that compared car sales on both sides of the border found that price gaps are narrowing.
"In all of our 'popular' segments ... the price gap between Canada and the U.S. narrowed in 2007," said industry analyst Dennis DesRosiers, who compiled the study.
The segments include subcompact and compact cars, compact sport utility vehicles, minivans and full-sized pickup trucks which, combined, represent two-thirds of the vehicles Canadians buy annually.
However, major gaps do still exist for luxury sports car buyers -- where buying in the U.S. could mean an average savings of $14,000.
I was not out to get in a pi$$ing match with someone who just wants to be a smart a$$. No prices will ever keep up with the fluctuation on the $ so there is really no sense in whining about it. A year ago when you took in to consideration the value of the $ there wasn't much, if any, difference on simalarily equipped vehicles, and 5+ years ago it was, as I mentioned, the other way around and Toyota put a stop to it at that time as well. As for fair price.... that is simply the amount at which both the selling party and the buying party agree to make a deal. As for buying on ebay, sure I have, but not because I was saving money, but rather because I could not find what I was looking for here. At any rate, I just don't understand why people whine and complain about things they can do nothing about (like gas prices...lol) it is a waste of energy!
Maybe I am just different than most, I wouldn't bother with the hassel unless I couldn't get what I wanted here.
Wow!!! That first line in your post to Big Steve is certainly not going to score any Toyota sales from this forum. I didn't see anything in Steve's post to you that indicated that he was trying to be a "smart a$$". IMO, he was only trying to explain to you, using examples, that we are now in a global market and that your competition is not only limited to Canada.
You state that "5+ years ago it was," "the other way around and Toyota put a stop to it at that time as well." Well, yes they did do that by voiding warranties on Toyotas going from Canada to the U.S. And Toyota was sued because of it and lost. As you well know, Toyota now honours warranties in both U.S. and Canada but have taken the different approach of getting U.S. dealers to sign agreements not to sell to Canadians.
I would suggest that it would be far more productive if all the Canadian auto dealers, collectively, went after the auto manufacturers demanding that you want the ability to compete. I believe that auto dealers in Canada are victims just as much as the Canadian consumer. However, I don't see a solution coming to the Canadian auto dealers without a similar solution brought in for the Canadian Consumer.
Re: U.S. vs. Canadian new car prices
. Am I still correct in assumeing that the US vehiles would have to be converted to read in Metric (particularily the odometer)? I know this was the case when I worked for a Chrysler dealer years ago. At that time they also required a DRL to be installed as well before the car/truck could be registered.
It affects every aspect of our economy, not just those of you looking to buy a new vehiclle....what about those of us selling them? You don't hear me complaining about the people who do decide to go to the US to buy vehicles, just don't come crying to me when you have problems and can't get parts...too bad soo sad!!!
Linear Mode
