You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
Pricing and DealersDiscussions that are specific to vehicle pricing, preferred dealer pricing, current incentives, rebates, and experiences.
This is a discussion thread titled "What price were you Quoted on 2007 Tundra?", within the Pricing and Dealers forum, part of the Marketplace Forums category.
Big money at dealerships is the profit in service not in sales
That and the large profit they make playing with the numbers on any trade-in and in house Dealer financing.
I will wait for a 4WD, 5.7L, long bed regular cab to be re-sold as a Toyota CPO truck.
I did this with my current '02. I saved thousands and couldn't be happier
Your own math answered this question already. yes a 33k truck cost the dealer about 30k, about 3k in profit margin if sold at sticker. plus any hold back they get if it is their truck originally. One of the reasons, dealers like to sell them fast is so they dont pay interest on them.
far less profit in vehicles for the dealers then you think. Big money at dealerships is the profit in service not in sales
Question: Is that $3,000 profit paid by the customer or are you factoring in hold-back? In that case, maybe the customer didn't pay nearly that much over invoice.
A dealer who charges the CUSTOMER $3,000 over invoice on a $30K truck is guilty of rape. Most folks on this board have at least one or two friends or contacts in the industry, who will tell them all about invoice price, markup and how and how much dealers make on a sale. All you have to do is find out how it works from the dealer's point of view (and many of you already know this). A friend of mine who works for a dealer said typically a volume dealer would jump at making $500 over invoice. Yes, that varies due to to demand, type of vehicle and other factors but when you factor in hold-back and other incentives for the dealer, that's a tidy profit. Adding hold-back and other other stuff to a deal where the customer already paid $3000 over invoice is just insane. I'm sure they probably have portraits of these customers hanging in their break-room with propeller hats painted on their heads.
Question: Is that $3,000 profit paid by the customer or are you factoring in hold-back? In that case, maybe the customer didn't pay nearly that much over invoice.
A dealer who charges the CUSTOMER $3,000 over invoice on a $30K truck is guilty of rape. Most folks on this board have at least one or two friends or contacts in the industry, who will tell them all about invoice price, markup and how and how much dealers make on a sale. All you have to do is find out how it works from the dealer's point of view (and many of you already know this). A friend of mine who works for a dealer said typically a volume dealer would jump at making $500 over invoice. Yes, that varies due to to demand, type of vehicle and other factors but when you factor in hold-back and other incentives for the dealer, that's a tidy profit. Adding hold-back and other other stuff to a deal where the customer already paid $3000 over invoice is just insane. I'm sure they probably have portraits of these customers hanging in their break-room with propeller hats painted on their heads.
First of all a dealer can try to charge you anything they want, It is up to you to say no or yes.
some trucks have more than 3k profit and some trucks have about $1500, It depends on what model and options are on it.
I have been discounting them since before I even got my first one so not everybody is guilty of rape.
$500 over on 99% of our cars and I would be happy as hell you are right there. Most of the cars now sell for less than if not right at invoice.
I would sell a corolla for 800 back any day of the week and I even sell the hybrid Prius for invoice right now. So there are plenty of deals to be made out there.
Invoice pricing is not a secret, Most dealers would rather show you the actual invoice then have you guess at what it is. Customers never guess higher than it is for sure, lol
__________________
Cory Ellerbee
Truck Manager/Internet Sales Manager
San Francisco Toyota
(415) 395-6364 or corye@sftoyota.com
That and the large profit they make playing with the numbers on any trade-in and in house Dealer financing.
As suggested plenty of times on here, bring your own financing and sell your car yourself and you never have to worry about either of those two things.
__________________
Cory Ellerbee
Truck Manager/Internet Sales Manager
San Francisco Toyota
(415) 395-6364 or corye@sftoyota.com
Question: Is that $3,000 profit paid by the customer or are you factoring in hold-back? In that case, maybe the customer didn't pay nearly that much over invoice.
A dealer who charges the CUSTOMER $3,000 over invoice on a $30K truck is guilty of rape. Most folks on this board have at least one or two friends or contacts in the industry, who will tell them all about invoice price, markup and how and how much dealers make on a sale. All you have to do is find out how it works from the dealer's point of view (and many of you already know this). A friend of mine who works for a dealer said typically a volume dealer would jump at making $500 over invoice. Yes, that varies due to to demand, type of vehicle and other factors but when you factor in hold-back and other incentives for the dealer, that's a tidy profit. Adding hold-back and other other stuff to a deal where the customer already paid $3000 over invoice is just insane. I'm sure they probably have portraits of these customers hanging in their break-room with propeller hats painted on their heads.
You are talking about rape? Why? A 10% profit margin is not so much IMO. Please keep in mind that these dealers have to make a profit and what do you think how high the profit margin on other goods is? You would be shocked when you compare that to the usual 10% a car dealer has. And you as a customer has always the oppertuniy to try to lower the price. And if you don't like it, go and try to shop somewere else. But please treat Cory and the other few dealers here on this forum, which share a lot of confidential information's with us, with a litte bit of respect.
You are talking about rape? Why? A 10% profit margin is not so much IMO. Please keep in mind that these dealers have to make a profit and what do you think how high the profit margin on other goods is? You would be shocked when you compare that to the usual 10% a car dealer has. And you as a customer has always the oppertuniy to try to lower the price. And if you don't like it, go and try to shop somewere else. But please treat Cory and the other few dealers here on this forum, which share a lot of confidential information's with us, with a litte bit of respect.
Jochen
I'm not treating anyone with disrespect. I'm simply talking about buying a truck, and what I think is fair for both the dealer and the customer. As someone said, a dealer has the right to price his vehicle any way he wishes. He can even tell me he's charging $1,000 OVER MSRP. He can tell me to like it or hit the road. But I'm one of the customers Toyota is hoping to sell 200,000 units to next year. Toyota has to hold on to customers like me to expand that market share they keep talking about. All I'm saying is that if pricing becomes a barrier then a lot of folks won't even give this truck a try. I know it's a good truck, but it's not the only good truck out there.
I didn't invent this silly game of negotiating vehicle price. It's the only thing we buy where we have to engage in this sort of thing. You don't go to the grocer and pick up a 79 cent can of soup and tell the grocer you'll pay him 69 cents for it. So if this is the game we must play, it is NOT being disrespectful to make sure you are paying a fair price.
While Toyotas have better resale value that their domestic counterparts I believe this point is overblown. If I pay $34K for the Toyota financed for 36 mos at 3.9% and after 3 years I made $36,083 in payments am I really better off than if I pay $27K for a comparable F-150 financed for the same terms with total payments of $28,525? At the end of 3 years will the Tundra really be worth $8000 more than the F-150?
Based on what the trade in values for 2004 F-150s and 2004 Tundras are you would be hard pressed to get a trade in value spread close to that $6-8K, it is closer to $17K for the Ford XLT and $19K for the Tundra Limited same mileage, spread $2-3K.
It isn’t always as black and white as “Toyota trade in is so much higher it justifies paying more for”.
While Toyotas have better resale value that their domestic counterparts I believe this point is overblown. If I pay $34K for the Toyota financed for 36 mos at 3.9% and after 3 years I made $36,083 in payments am I really better off than if I pay $27K for a comparable F-150 financed for the same terms with total payments of $28,525? At the end of 3 years will the Tundra really be worth $8000 more than the F-150?
Based on what the trade in values for 2004 F-150s and 2004 Tundras are you would be hard pressed to get a trade in value spread close to that $6-8K, it is closer to $17K for the Ford XLT and $19K for the Tundra Limited same mileage, spread $2-3K.
It isn’t always as black and white as “Toyota trade in is so much higher it justifies paying more for”.
Exactly. I'm a Toyota fan. I really believe in them, but I sure didn't pay sticker for the Toyota I'm driving now, and knowing how these vehicles are marked up I'm not about to pay MSRP for one now. A dealer may tell me he's got plenty of customers who will pay MSRP and for me to take my business elsewhere. That's okay, and that's what I'll do. But it would be a real shame. I want to stay in a Toyota, and I want to see Toyota do well in the truck market. Whoever invented the unwritten rule of paying MSRP in the first year of a production vehicle may be hurting market share. Supply and demand may allow them to do this, but all it does is keep Ford, Chevy and Dodge customers from switching, and it chases away a few Toyota loyalists, too.
I went to a local dealer at lunch today and drove a Limited 2X DC. When asked, the sales guy told me they would be selling at MSRP for a long time beacuse they are new to the market. We'll see.
That's what they always say. And they're never right.
It only took them six months to shake that attitude on the new FJ Cruiser and that is a more limitied appeal/production/volume item.
Question: Is that $3,000 profit paid by the customer or are you factoring in hold-back? In that case, maybe the customer didn't pay nearly that much over invoice.
A dealer who charges the CUSTOMER $3,000 over invoice on a $30K truck is guilty of rape. Most folks on this board have at least one or two friends or contacts in the industry, who will tell them all about invoice price, markup and how and how much dealers make on a sale. All you have to do is find out how it works from the dealer's point of view (and many of you already know this). A friend of mine who works for a dealer said typically a volume dealer would jump at making $500 over invoice. Yes, that varies due to to demand, type of vehicle and other factors but when you factor in hold-back and other incentives for the dealer, that's a tidy profit. Adding hold-back and other other stuff to a deal where the customer already paid $3000 over invoice is just insane. I'm sure they probably have portraits of these customers hanging in their break-room with propeller hats painted on their heads.
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/vehicles/tundra/pricing/
These are guidelines and they are close ball park Pricing don't let someone rape you on the add on
feature's and wile these prices can not be establish now They will next year and that is too be expected.I've gotten some great deals waiting on all My Toyota Product's..
Your above quote is right Like Me I know someone in the Industry. Get this I called about an sr5 4wd crewmax and receive a Quote of $43,000 for an sr5 to $53,000 for a Navi limited edition. These prices will come down to a Normal level like posted on Toyota website and Ts They alway's do .I see these prices as No different from the 2000 Tundra when it came out in sept 1999. Oh yea it's interesting to see the buyer tell the Toyota Stealer ship where to go just the other day I was getting my Oil change when I noticed a customer looking at a regular cab for $29k and thought they were crazy for something that should retail about 23k to 25k.Who in there right Mind would pay 29k for a sr5 regular with with bare bones feature's El Stripped O Truck Not me esp for a few grand More you can get the Double cab's for the same price.Buyer's be aware this is the same Sales tactics like the Fj cruiser and 2005 Tacoma and the Tundra is No different on customers first in line to pay Full retail vs receiving the end of the year deals that does happened.Point to make supple and demand for the 2008 Tundra will not be large to the extent it it today and we all Know this will happened and see the Prices Fluctuate or stabilize. Sales people will tell you what they want you to hear But I've gotten some deal's and Know it very much will come down..
__________________
T3 Grill, Line X extra front Bumper coating
I didn't invent this silly game of negotiating vehicle price. It's the only thing we buy where we have to engage in this sort of thing. You don't go to the grocer and pick up a 79 cent can of soup and tell the grocer you'll pay him 69 cents for it. So if this is the game we must play, it is NOT being disrespectful to make sure you are paying a fair price.
"The only thing we buy where we have to engage in this sort of thing?" What planet are you living on? Ever buy a house? Home improvements? ebay? Travel much?
Bartering started well before the exchange of money was invented. Just travel to any 2nd or 3rd world countries and see how many items have actual price tags on them.
Car buying is and always has been a buyers market. That means dealers must be able to discount their product to enhance the deal. Almost every product from a mfg. has an MSRP. Almost no retailers sell a product for MSRP unless there is some unusual demand or significance for the product.
The beauty of this system is that products are generally worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Otherwise, they'll hold off or find a different product or seller.
__________________ 2006 DC SR5 V8 4x4 Phantom Gray Metallic
2003 Honda Pilot EXL 4WD Black
"The only thing we buy where we have to engage in this sort of thing?" What planet are you living on? Ever buy a house? Home improvements? ebay? Travel much?
Bartering started well before the exchange of money was invented. Just travel to any 2nd or 3rd world countries and see how many items have actual price tags on them.
Car buying is and always has been a buyers market. That means dealers must be able to discount their product to enhance the deal. Almost every product from a mfg. has an MSRP. Almost no retailers sell a product for MSRP unless there is some unusual demand or significance for the product.
The beauty of this system is that products are generally worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Otherwise, they'll hold off or find a different product or seller.
Okay, so I didn't list the 10 things that we barter for, as opposed to the 10 million things we don't barter for. I think you get my point, but if not I'm just saying that the process is cut-throat. You say "the beauty" of this system is that vehicles are generally worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Suppose we are talking about two identical new vehicles - you are saying one is worth more to this guy than the other is to the next guy? That's just an excuse to gouge someone.
You might go in, grind the sales guy and get a car for $300 over invoice, but an hour later a single mother goes in and gets shafted with a price that's $2,000 over invoice for the exact same vehicle. There's nothing "beautiful" about that process, and it happens every day. Go to edmunds.com and read the lengthy piece about the writer who went undercover and worked in the car sales industry to find out how it works.
You and I both know they don't give the same deal to every customer. Why is that? If they had two identical trucks on the lot you and I would pay two different prices for it. Why? It's a game. That's all.
I'm all for playing the game, but as I said before I will not pay MSRP. I'm the guy who wants it closer to $300 over invoice. I'm not the single mother who gets charged $2K over.
MSRP at the dealer and on Toyota's build your own website was $42693.00.
Saturday, I paid $40500.00 which is $2193 less than MSRP.
Invoice was $39000. Roughly 9.1% under.
I "saved" $2193, they "made" $1500. I think I got a good deal on a Truck that wasn't even supposed to be released until tomorrow. I do not have the truck yet, they had to "preference" it from the port.
Oh and before anyone asks, yes, I paid tax on top of the number above.
MSRP at the dealer and on Toyota's build your own website was $42693.00.
Saturday, I paid $40500.00 which is $2193 less than MSRP.
Invoice was $39000. Roughly 9.1% under.
I "saved" $2193, they "made" $1500. I think I got a good deal on a Truck that wasn't even supposed to be released until tomorrow. I do not have the truck yet, they had to "preference" it from the port.
Oh and before anyone asks, yes, I paid tax on top of the number above.
As long as your happy with the Transaction More power to you that my friend is the best peice of advice and yes this pricing stuff will come down in the near future Supple and demand always happens. Did they give you a $500 customer loyally discount or did you know about that..Kept us posted on your Truck first year expriences.
ERik
__________________
T3 Grill, Line X extra front Bumper coating
TundraMaxxer: Okay, so I didn't list the 10 things that we barter for, as opposed to the 10 million things we don't barter for. I think you get my point, but if not I'm just saying that the process is cut-throat. You say "the beauty" of this system is that vehicles are generally worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Suppose we are talking about two identical new vehicles - you are saying one is worth more to this guy than the other is to the next guy? That's just an excuse to gouge someone.
10 things? How about most purchases over a few thousand dollars? How would you like it if every dealership was like Carmax? And yes, I am definitely saying one is worth more to this guy than the other guy. One may not value the actual price as much as timing (maybe he makes a few hundred grand a year) and is willing to pay a premium to buy today, as opposed to the guy who waits until the last day of the quarter to get that extra grand off the vehicle (retired on fixed income). It's not an excuse to gouge someone. Do you know what car sales staff turnover is?
Quote:
You might go in, grind the sales guy and get a car for $300 over invoice, but an hour later a single mother goes in and gets shafted with a price that's $2,000 over invoice for the exact same vehicle. There's nothing "beautiful" about that process, and it happens every day. Go to Edmunds.com and read the lengthy piece about the writer who went undercover and worked in the car sales industry to find out how it works.
There's no doubt many pay more for a vehicle than they should. The issue is, if they didn't - you and I wouldn't be able to get those vehicles for $300 over invoice. It all evens out in the end. A dealer selling every vehicle for $300 over invoice would go out of business. A dealer selling every vehicle for $500 under MSRP would also go out of business. If all cars were priced the same, then megadealerships would take over the smaller dealerships due to volume. Sometimes people will pay a higher price at a dealership due to service, past experience, and convenience.
__________________ 2006 DC SR5 V8 4x4 Phantom Gray Metallic
2003 Honda Pilot EXL 4WD Black
Re: What price were you Quoted on 2007 Tundra?
and yes this pricing stuff will come down in the near future Supple and demand always happens. Did they give you a $500 customer loyally discount or did you know about that..Kept us posted on your Truck first year expriences.
Linear Mode
