TW SAW'S Installation help

[rsixrocket]

I purchased a USED set of Teamwest Sway-A-Way coilovers last weekend for my 2003 2WD Tundra. I decided to tackle the installation myself so I could get a better understanding of the suspension components. I have never done any suspension work before but even from a newbie's perspective, the installation was pretty straight forward and logical.... even without any instructions.

With that said, I've come across three issues that I need help resolving.

1) Coilover collar adjustment - I currently have the collars set at 1.75" (driver) and 1.25" (passenger) of thread showing (pics in "my photos"). These are the measurements I was told to adjust the coilovers to. Are these settings correct and is it wise/safe to leave it as is? The last thing I want to do is damage any other components. I’m considering getting the Total Chaos upper but that will be WAY down the line when my wallet can afford it.

2) Ride quality – The ride quality has changed significantly. It’s pretty harsh even when going over speed bumps at 5mph. The previous owner said that the coilovers were used for approximately 7000 miles without any problems. Any thoughts on what the problem could be?

3) Rear lift – In addition to the SAW’s, I installed Wheeler’s 1.5” AAL’s. Even with the AAL’s, the rear now sits lower than the front. I like the current height of the front and want the rear at the same level or a bit higher. What do I need to do? Can I add an additional leaf(s) or add a block?

Any comments or suggestions? BTW, I did search all pages in the “suspension” forum and read the “Offroad FAQ”. GOOD STUFF but no answers to the above questions.

Thanks!

[breakmark]

Originally Posted by rsixrocket

I purchased a USED set of Teamwest Sway-A-Way coilovers last weekend for my 2003 2WD Tundra.

With that said, I've come across three issues that I need help resolving.

1) Coilover collar adjustment - I currently have the collars set at 1.75" (driver) and 1.25" (passenger) of thread showing (pics in "my photos").

For a 2-2.5 inch lift, I think mine are set at more like 3/4 of an inch to an inch of thread showing. Measure the height of the wheelwell at the front tire center. 2.5 inches of lift (max for you) is approximately 37-37.5 inches with stock tires. With 33s, it'll be more like 38-38.5 inches.

Originally Posted by rsixrocket

2) Ride quality – The ride quality has changed significantly. It’s pretty harsh even when going over speed bumps at 5mph. The previous owner said that the coilovers were used for approximately 7000 miles without any problems. Any thoughts on what the problem could be?

Two comments: 1) You did realize that when you bought the TWs for a firmer ride, right? Offroading usually requires a stiffer shock (certainly true for the TWs), and I think even the spring rate on Bill's setup is 100 lbs heavier than stock (Is this true? Does anyone know?) 2) If your coilovers are really cranked too high, the ride would definately feel stiff as a board.

Originally Posted by rsixrocket

3) Rear lift – In addition to the SAW’s, I installed Wheeler’s 1.5” AAL’s. Even with the AAL’s, the rear now sits lower than the front. I like the current height of the front and want the rear at the same level or a bit higher. What do I need to do? Can I add an additional leaf(s) or add a block?

Once again, sounds like you might be too high in the front. If after checking your height, you still feel like the rear is too low, your alternatives are pretty much either going to a block, or replacing the rear springs with new ones (Deaver, Alcan, NWOR etc).

Hope this helps. I suspect that others may have some better (even conflicting?) suggestions, but those are my initial thoughts.

[DevinSixtySeven]

1- what are those measurements in relation to? lift height, or amount of thread showing? my collars are very nearly at the same spot...about 1/8" different i think between driver (heavy side) and passenger units, tho the amount of thread showing on my units is completely unrelated given my setup. please measure lift from hub center to wheel well, not ground to wheel well...this removes any slop from tire radius.

2- put some weight up front, like a brush guard, bull bar, etc...ride quality is related to the spring's weight rating and how close the load is to that rating. that part's implicit in the FAQ, sorry if it's not clearer...basically, the smoothest ride is from the stock coilovers, anything stiffer needs some weight up front. also, i'm pretty sure if i'm certain of the source of those coilovers that those springs are very new, and probably still very stiff. they will mellow with age and use...go 'wheeling, slow and with lots of off-camber stuff to work them in.

3- this could be false lift, if you measured before you drove the truck. drive it around the block and measure again. if the front is still higher, you definately cranked it too high.

i'll go check the FAQ again, i know ive mentioned #3 and #2 to a few guys, dunno if its in the FAQ...thanks for the heads up.

-s

[breakmark]

Originally Posted by DevinSixtySeven

1- what are those measurements in relation to? lift height, or amount of thread showing? please measure lift from hub center to wheel well, not ground to wheel well...this removes any slop from tire radius.

Just as an FYI, what would 2.5 inches of lift measure from the hub center to the wheel well? (All the early threads from two years ago quoted measurements from the ground.) I'll go check mine for comparison as well.

[rsixrocket]

Originally Posted by breakmark

For a 2-2.5 inch lift, I think mine are set at more like 3/4 of an inch to an inch of thread showing. Measure the height of the wheelwell at the front tire center. 2.5 inches of lift (max for you) is approximately 37-37.5 inches with stock tires. With 33s, it'll be more like 38-38.5 inches.

I was told by Bill to set it to 1.75" and 1.25". He said that would result in approx 38.5" from ground to fender as you stated. I set it to the above specs, drove it around the block to settle the wheels/suspension and measured. It measured in at 40.5" from ground to the edge of the fender flare/trim (SR5 Chrome Flare/trim). This is what I can understand. What could be wrong?

Originally Posted by breakmark

Two comments: 1) You did realize that when you bought the TWs for a firmer ride, right? Offroading usually requires a stiffer shock (certainly true for the TWs), and I think even the spring rate on Bill's setup is 100 lbs heavier than stock (Is this true? Does anyone know?) 2) If your coilovers are really cranked too high, the ride would definately feel stiff as a board.

Yes, I was aware that the ride will be firmer but "firmer" is definitely different than "harsh". This ride is harsh.

Originally Posted by DevinSixtySeven

1- what are those measurements in relation to? lift height, or amount of thread showing? my collars are very nearly at the same spot...about 1/8" different i think between driver (heavy side) and passenger units...

Those measurements are the amount of thread showing on each coilover. See "my photos". You'll see what I mean. Is it too much? Too little?

Originally Posted by DevinSixtySeven

3- this could be false lift, if you measured before you drove the truck. drive it around the block and measure again. if the front is still higher, you definately cranked it too high.

After I adjusted the coils, I drove it around the block to settle the wheels. I'll try readjusting the collars.

THANK YOU guys for your comments. Much appreciated.

Any other thoughts?

[TMS2U]

40.5 is too high if that measurement is correct (you got 2x yes?) That may explain why you describe the ride as "harsh" and the AAL's dont level out you rig. What were they adjusted to from the previous owner? Is your truck on jack stands in your pics or is that the suspension current ride height. If it is, your ball joints are pretty maxxed out

[breakmark]

Originally Posted by rsixrocket

I was told by Bill to set it to 1.75" and 1.25". He said that would result in approx 38.5" from ground to fender as you stated. I set it to the above specs, drove it around the block to settle the wheels/suspension and measured. It measured in at 40.5" from ground to the edge of the fender flare/trim (SR5 Chrome Flare/trim). This is what I can understand. What could be wrong?

I'm thinking that you have WAY overcranked your coilovers. If you're actually at 40.5 inches, you're lifted 4.5 inches or so(?) You better let her back down about half-way or so until they relax more, or risk blowing your ball joints. I'm also SR5, and at about 38 inches, and I figure I'm lifted about 2-inches, FYI.

[DevinSixtySeven]

hollllllllllly CRAP ...dude, lower those things quick ! breakmark's dead on.

i'm at around 40" in front, and that's with uniballs at 4" and 33" tires, measured ground to well . dyam...

somebody with a stock tundra, please chime in with a measurement from the center of your front hub to the lip of your wheel well, not ground to wheel well, so we can get a baseline reading.

-s

[rsixrocket]

Originally Posted by TMS2U

40.5 is too high if that measurement is correct (you got 2x yes?) That may explain why you describe the ride as "harsh" and the AAL's dont level out you rig. What were they adjusted to from the previous owner? Is your truck on jack stands in your pics or is that the suspension current ride height. If it is, your ball joints are pretty maxxed out

Yes, its a 2x. It's also on jack stands in the picture.


damn.......

[DevinSixtySeven]

i'ma make a few guesses here based on my own setup and your pictures...those are the new 15" coils, not the old 14" coils like i have. i have about 3" of thread showing on a 14" coil, so removing 1" for lift and ~1" for spring height, you shouldn't have much more than an inch of thread showing. the 1.75 and 1.5 measurements, bill may have been assuming the 14" coil that originally came with that set of coilovers, or he may have figured youre 4x2 and wanted the max lift, with a little slop for the ball joints. bring them down to about 1" passenger side, and 1-1/8" driver's side, and remember 1" of lift at the coilover is about 1.6" lift at the wheel, iirc. anything higher than 2" and you should consider the uniball uppers from the geometry alone, never mind the ball joint's ride angle at that height.

-s

[rsixrocket]

Originally Posted by DevinSixtySeven

i'm at around 40" in front, and that's with uniballs at 4" and 33" tires, measured ground to well . dyam...

You're just jealous because my truck is higher than yours. lol

Seriously though. This is getting frustratrating. On the brighter side of things, I just talked to Bill and he has kindly volunteered to take a look at my setup tonight. I'll be sure to crank them back down before I make that 70 mile trek to his place. I'll keep you guys updated.

Thanks.

[rsixrocket]

Originally Posted by DevinSixtySeven

i'ma make a few guesses here based on my own setup and your pictures...those are the new 15" coils, not the old 14" coils like i have. i have about 3" of thread showing on a 14" coil, so removing 1" for lift and ~1" for spring height, you shouldn't have much more than an inch of thread showing. the 1.75 and 1.5 measurements, bill may have been assuming the 14" coil that originally came with that set of coilovers, or he may have figured youre 4x2 and wanted the max lift, with a little slop for the ball joints. bring them down to about 1" passenger side, and 1-1/8" driver's side, and remember 1" of lift at the coilover is about 1.6" lift at the wheel, iirc. anything higher than 2" and you should consider the uniball uppers from the geometry alone, never mind the ball joint's ride angle at that height.

-s

Thank you sir. I'll crank them down to 1" and 1.125" before I hit the road tonight.

BTW, what's "iirc"? I've seen you use that in other threads.

[DevinSixtySeven]

LOL...dangit, outlifted again . iirc = "if i recall correctly".

-s

[dezert_rida]

somebody with a stock tundra, please chime in with a measurement from the center of your front hub to the lip of your wheel well, not ground to wheel well, so we can get a baseline reading.

-s

20 1/8" from center of hub to fenderwell lip with SR5 chrome trim, access cab, V8 2wd uphill on a 15 degree driveway. Next time its level in the street ill measure and post.

[rsixrocket]

First off, a big THANKS to Bill West for making time between his busy work and family life to help a fellow Tundra owner out last night. He's one cool cat.

Here's the outcome:

1) Ride height - Bill double checked and confirmed that I did indeed do the installation correctly. Cool. The only thing that needed to be done is adjust the collar to get the front of the truck at a safe and appropriate level. Doh! I took DevinSixtySeven's advise and backed the collars down to 1" and 1.125". It now sits at 39.5", ground to fender. I'll back it down even more tonight.

2) Ride quality - In our initial phone conversation, Bill suspected that the nitrogen level maybe low. Sure enough when Bill checked it was low to none. He recharged both shocks to spec..... difference was night and day. Apparently, these coilovers were removed by a Toyota dealer as part of a trade in agreement. They probably emptied the nitrogen thinking it would be easier to remove the coilovers. Bill suggested that I bring the truck back to him so he can recheck the shocks to ensure they're not leaking or damaged.

So far, I'm pleased with the TW SAW's now that they're working properly and very pleased with the level of service I've received from Bill himself.

Thanks to everyone else for the tips and suggestions!