Did I just get a Wed-Thu truck? My Tacoma has no problems other than a vibrating a/c blower motor. I've had my truck for a year now, and I sit on the tailgate with my two dogs all the time (300lbs total) - feels every bit as solid as my 02 Chevy 2500HD did.
I will admit, I never had any problems with the Chevy other than the 11 mpg, so if anyone is thinking they need a "real truck" I would recommmend Chevy. I traded an 02 Tundra in for that truck becuase the Tundra had 5 different rattles inside, and the tires were all cupped at 13,000 miles and the dealer was of no help whatsoever. In retrospect, I should have made them fix the problems, but they were a complete turn off, and I just wanted out.
I agree -- I plan to hold their feet to the fire on this, especially after browsing some full-size trucks last night and wondering why I'm about to shell out more money for one and the extra gas. Statistically speaking (although the logic's actually flawed as it should be), if it's normal then based on their 05 truck sales, they should have at least 45000 separate reports on this vibration. If anything, just based on principle, they should stand behind their product.
BTW, according to the Toyota logic, you should take yours in to have the vibrations and clunking put in the driveline. While the Toyota Customer Service rep was insisting these vibrations are normal, I asked her if the advice I should give to someone without the "normal vibrations" is to take it into a dealer, and her reply was "yes". Imagine the reaction on the service manager's face if you were to do such a thing...
Too funny! I forgot to mention I did have the "exhaust tick" problem (although this was more just an annoyance at the sound) TSB done, but the new manifolds didn't do much, if anything, in my opinion. The service manager had not heard of this problem or TSB, but did the work because I shoved the printed TSB into his hands!
I would love to see the look on their face if I were to take the truck in and say I'm missing the shudder in the transmission....please add this missing feature
The exhaust tick was from the manifold? I just purchased an 06 and have almost 300 miles on it and it has ticked since day one. (last week) I just haven't had a chance to get back to the dealership. It ticks more (louder) when I'm on the throttle and after it is warmed up.
Although my '05 Tacoma is a manual transmission, it has plenty of problems. Severe chatter or judder trying to engage the clutch, transmission grinding when shifting, exhaust ticking, abnormal and excessive tire wear...the list goes on. Toyota claims that all of this is normal...they won't even perform the exhaust tick TSB!!! A vehicle malfunction is not normal just because Toyota says it is. Take them to arbitration (that part is free), then take them to court if you have to. The more people who do this, the better. It seems to me like they are going to need to be forced to stand behind their product.
After reading through this thread, I'm trying figure out if what I'm experiancing is what the majority is experiancing (05 Access Cab, Auto, TRD #2). A shaking or heavy vibration, particulary through the steering wheel from 60mph to 70mph, a jolt forward when you are sitting at a stop light, and problems with the cruise that when you set it, it will drop about 5mph and then decide to kick in by shifting down a gear or two and costing $5 in gas. Thanks.
I started this thread due to the transmission shudder (see first post of this thread). But the vibration you feel from 60-70 seems to be common as well. I go down the road at these speeds, and my sun visors are flapping up and down, my feet are vibrating, legs shaking, and steering wheel vibrating like crazy. All I've gotten from the dealer is that they (Toyota) are looking into it.
I'm tired of getting smoke blown up my A$$. I strongly suspect the vibration is due to one or a combination of things; Bridgestone POS factory tires that will not balance, split drive shaft system, carrier bearing, incorrect pinion angle, or rear differential.
I've complained to my dealer 5 times about the problem, and they won't even take the truck in. They just keep saying that they want to wait for Toyota techs to look into the problem and issue a TSB with a fix. I discovered yesterday that the service manager has never entered a complaint into their database on my truck, even after 5 complaints. Guess he's after the "customer satisfaction" award. It's now time to call Toyota.
I did have a bad vibration when I first bout my truck. After balancing the tires for the second time with 1300 miles on the truck, the service manager took a complete set off a brand new truck, balanced them and put them on my truck. All fixed
Wow - I guess I am lucky - my truck is smooth as silk right up to the rev limit and I haven't had anything done to it at all. Sun visors flapping, etc. - man that is not normal - you need to attack your dealer! I can tell you that at least some Tacomas do not have that problem at all, and none of them should in my opinion.
Well....for $28K, I feel there should not be ANY of these problems. It's apparent to me that Toyota has slipped from "quality" to "quantity" in a few short years. This is my 5th Toyota, and possibly my last due to the lack of service and respect Toyota is showing to faithful customers.
Well....for $28K, I feel there should not be ANY of these problems. It's apparent to me that Toyota has slipped from "quality" to "quantity" in a few short years. This is my 5th Toyota, and possibly my last due to the lack of service and respect Toyota is showing to faithful customers.
Maddog, they are blowing smoke if they've told you Toyota plans to address the vibration issue. According to my case rep, Toyota has no intention of addressing this as a problem -- they insist it is normal. I spoke (again) to Toyota Customer Service last night, and my case rep stated that she will try to arrange a test drive with the regional rep, but the regional rep will probably just side with the SMs who have stated it's normal by Tacoma design. She then went on to describe the arbitration process -- not very encouraging from the "stand behind the product" standpoint.
I plan to take them to arbitration and attack their faulty logic about the transmission shudder being "normal". Statistically, for something to be normal, 68% of the vehicles must have it -- in other words, the vibration/shudder must be strong enough to have been felt by 68% of Tacoma owners. Since Toyota insists on same year/model (mine's an extended cab SR5 4WD), out of the 65k 4WD MY05 vehicles sold, approximately 1/3 of those (no figures publicly available) will be like mine -- 21k. So, Toyota should have about 14k complaints logged about the vibration, or at a minimum 14k vehicles documented as having the shudder. Any less than 14k complaints, then they cannot claim that it's a "normal design feature". Especially since SMs only deal with people who have complaints, you can't use an SM's experience as a means to define normal.
Logic fault 2: Since the dealerships can only perform warranty maintenance by the Toyota books, if there is no fix or troubleshooting tree for a problem, they can only call a problem like this normal (this is the "fox guarding the hen house" logic).
Logic fault 3: The dealer will compare your vehicle to one on the lot. Since the only 05's on the lot are used, someone traded it in for some reason. Seldom does someone trade in a newer vehicle unless it has an issue that cannot be resolved. There is much less weight behind the 3rd logic fault since there are a number of other reasons people trade in vehicles, but it still makes for a reasonable enough argument to add some credence to Logic fault 2.
I've had the same problems (except the exhaust tick), and the shudder and "clunk" still remain. When I bought the truck, neither were present, so I find it very hard to believe they are merely part of the design. On the tire balance issue (60-70 shaking), it took 6 trips to 3 different places to get that sorted out. It turned out my dealer had put a set of another customer's tires (i.e. used) on my vehicle, promising to fix it with the "rim on order". Long story short, what was initially stated to be 1 rim swapped turned out to be the whole set. According to Toyota, this is acceptable for a dealer to put used tires on a new vehicle and pass someone else's problems onto a new customer. The real point here is that the dealer tried to claim that it's normal for a Tacoma steering wheel to shake violently at 60-70 since it's a truck. Amazingly, when I found a dealer with a calibrated balance machine and who apparently knows what he's doing, the problem went away.
Toyota has taken a bad turn, and expects loyalty from its customers based on its reputation not its actions. The only way they will respond to these issues is by us following through and eventually affecting their sales (unfortunately, profits are what they really care about). In addition to posts to forums, I have promised to spread the word about my experience -- to date, I've convinced 3 friends not to look at Toyota (~$6000 out of the Toyota bottom line), and count on them to spread the word as well. I also plan to post to the various auto websites (edmunds, MSN, etc.) ,magazines (Truck Trend, Car & Driver, Popular Mechanics), as well as Consumer Reports, JD Power, etc. It's only when Toyota begins to see this kind of "advertising" affecting their bottom line that they will react -- letters and phone calls do not reach their potential buyers. If you don't speak out, it's no different than not correcting your kids when they do something wrong: the behavior becomes considered acceptable since you rewarded bad behavior. Toyota has come to feel that since their profitability is not affected by these problems, that it is acceptable not to address them.
Now, don't shoot the messenger here, but I think most of us agree that nowdays toyota is competing against the "big three". In the old days, toyota made cute little trucks that had very limited use in the eyes of "average american truck buyers". As their trucks (and the company) have grown, I think they can no longer build them- simple and waayyy over built. For one thing, to do this they would have to charge about 50 grand for a taco that could stand up to the abuse older, mid eighties toyota trucks did. Which means many current owners(myself included), would never have considered this brand as an option. Secondly, the majority of current taco buyers(myself included) want sexy looks with all kinds of bells and whistles that we will seldom if ever use.The goal of this and every vehicle manufacturer in the world is to out sell all the other guys-right now, today!- worry about next year when it gets here. So far, tacoma values are still sky high and quality is mostly acceptable- that's why I bought one instead of the usual chevy that I've bought every few years since time began. TSBs are terribly expensive for manufacturers so until waayyy more than a few disgruntled owners complain, NOTHING will EVER be done for those of us who don't like the way our trucks shift! When the trans issues or the plastic boxes start to affect the bottom line- you will see action on the next model year- no retro action or compensation for us will ever happen- I would bet the house on it. The only thing we can hope for is that some aftermarket company will feel there is enough of a market to create a software program to retrofit to our little group of trucks- remember how much liability lawyers cost. So the bottom line is; if you can't live with the shifting or vibrations, pedal it now while some other sucker will give you top dollar for it, or learn to live with half_ssed crap- I've been driving worse for years, so this is a step up for me!
I started this thread due to the transmission shudder (see first post of this thread). But the vibration you feel from 60-70 seems to be common as well. I go down the road at these speeds, and my sun visors are flapping up and down, my feet are vibrating, legs shaking, and steering wheel vibrating like crazy. All I've gotten from the dealer is that they (Toyota) are looking into it.
I'm tired of getting smoke blown up my A$$. I strongly suspect the vibration is due to one or a combination of things; Bridgestone POS factory tires that will not balance, split drive shaft system, carrier bearing, incorrect pinion angle, or rear differential.
I've complained to my dealer 5 times about the problem, and they won't even take the truck in. They just keep saying that they want to wait for Toyota techs to look into the problem and issue a TSB with a fix. I discovered yesterday that the service manager has never entered a complaint into their database on my truck, even after 5 complaints. Guess he's after the "customer satisfaction" award. It's now time to call Toyota.
There is a TSB describing how the tires need to be balanced on these trucks ... they are sensitive, and without the right tools and procedures Uncle Joe's garage probably isn't gonna cut it.
There is also a TSB on steering rack flutter. That TSB says to balance the tires first per the balancing TSB, and if that doesn't fix it, then do the steering rack flutter TSB.
I think a lot of bad service is driven by the dealers. Most guys on this board know more about these trucks then the dealerships do !!
Interesting. I have zero issues with my Taco's 5 speed auto tranny
Same here ... my late build 2005 doesn't have any TBS symptoms on anything. There are actually quite a few TSBs out on the Tacomas -- maybe about a dozen now, and I have looked at all the TSBs and my truck shows no symptoms of any of them. No engine tick, no squeaky leaf springs, no squeaks or rattles, etc, runs super strong and 5-sp auto tranny shifts nicely. Knock on wood ... "knock, knock, knock".
I can't understand how some trucks have issues and others don't. Must be manufacturing issues.
You guys who have definate TBS symptoms need to get your dealer to understand the TSB and fix the truck under warranty. Get Toyota Customer Service involved if the dealer is a bonehead.
Same here ... my late build 2005 doesn't have any TBS symptoms on anything. There are actually quite a few TSBs out on the Tacomas -- maybe about a dozen now, and I have looked at all the TSBs and my truck shows no symptoms of any of them. No engine tick, no squeaky leaf springs, no squeaks or rattles, etc, runs super strong and 5-sp auto tranny shifts nicely. Knock on wood ... "knock, knock, knock".
I can't understand how some trucks have issues and others don't. Must be manufacturing issues.
You guys who have definate TBS symptoms need to get your dealer to understand the TSB and fix the truck under warranty. Get Toyota Customer Service involved if the dealer is a bonehead.
Superbusa, you're right, it is very likely a manufacturing quality issue. All components are built with a specification -- e.g. a 1/2-inch bolt must be between 0.49 and 0.51 inches in diameter, and material must be of a certain composition and thickness etc. The tighter the spec, generally the better the performance and the higher the cost (remember the adage, "good, fast, cheap -- pick two"). Typically, [good] engineers will design to a spec that provides a good balance between cost and reliability. However, no matter how good the design, if your manufacturers are unable to consistently build toward the center of the specs, you end up with reliability and performance problems.
One of Toyota's hallmarks -- at least, used to be -- is the ability to control the manufacturing process very well while still producing very large quantities. My guess is that globalization, that is producing parts elsewhere since its cheaper, is biting them as it is many other industries. I'm not going to knock any specific country, however, there is a big difference between teaching someone from a lagging first-world nation or second-world nation to mass-produce a "widget" to a tight tolerance and teaching someone from a leading first-world nation (such as the U.S.) to do the same. This is why when Toyota and Honda began producing from the U.S. they were able to maintain their typical quality levels -- they were able to train people to think quality more easily here than in other places.
The other thing they are probably fighting is the pressure to bring things to market more quickly. Their engineers, despite better tools to design with, are probably doing less prototyping than they should and releasing sub-standard designs (harder to produce within specs or not tested within the whole 'system' -- i.e. the drivetrain).
Elfiero's right -- the small pickup has come a long way since Tacoma is now a mid-size pickup instead of a compact since Toyota found that they have to compete against Dodge in a market area. The problem is that they apparently succumbed to the pressure of bringing a product to market before they were ready (nine women and month will not make a baby). They know they have this problem with the Tacoma and a number of other vehicles that they have recently had recalls and TSBs with, and are wrestling with not having taken their own advice -- build quality in upfront to reduce problems down the road. In other words, they changed how they do business and don't want to answer to it -- they want us to simply shut up and be happy that it's a Toyota just like the Big 3 tried in the late '70's and early '80's. Here again, Elfiero's right -- we have to complain loudly if we want Toyota to stand behind their product and fix these things.
Re: Toyota addresses Tacoma transmission
. While the Toyota Customer Service rep was insisting these vibrations are normal, I asked her if the advice I should give to someone without the "normal vibrations" is to take it into a dealer, and her reply was "yes". Imagine the reaction on the service manager's face if you were to do such a thing...
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