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[MeasureMe]

Can someone explain what all these different initials mean:
GVWR, GAWR, etc. and how they relate to the weight you can tow?

I was doing a search for towing capacity for my 2000 Tundra, SR5, V8 and there were some other G-somethings mentioned, too. But I am having a hard time figuring out what it all means.

Can someone explain how to figure out if my Tundra can pull a 6,000+ 5th wheel. I have a heavy duty tow package (which I understand is basically an extra transmission cooler?).

Thanks in advance.

[HotRod8]

Let me try to explain some of this:

GAWR = Gross Axle Weight Rating; this is the maximum weight rating for the axle. According to my owner's manual the GAWRs for the Tundra are 3160LBs for the front and either 3760LBs or 3960LBs for the rear, depending on which size tires are installed.

GVWR = Gross Vehicle Weight Rating: this is the maximum your entire truck can weigh rolling down the road. This includes everything in or on your vehicle that affects how much it will weigh on a scale. For the Tundra (again from my '03 owner's manual) the GVWR ranges from 5500LBs to 6200LBs depending on whether it's V6 or V8, 2WD or 4WD and regular or access cab. It is important to note that the GVWR is less than the total of the front and rear GAWRs by about 1000 LBs.

GCVWR = Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating: this is the maximum that the total truck and trailer combination can weigh. For a V8 Tundra with the tow package this is 11 800 LBs.

To determine if you can pull this trailer you will need to know what your truck weighs when packed for a typical towing trip and then subtract that number from 11 800 LBs, this will give you the maximum trailer weight for your truck. If you don't know what your truck weighs packed for a typical trip you should consider packing it and taking it to the scales.

The other issue you are going to have with a 5th wheel trailer is the pin weight. I believe that it is recommended that 5th wheels are set up and packed etc. to produce roughly 20% of the trailer weight at the pin. For a 6000LB 5th wheel, this means you will have roughly 1200LBs extra right in the box of your truck, pretty much directly on the rear axle. My truck basically empty has a rear axle weight of pretty much 2400LBs, by the time you add a 5th wheel hitch, at I don't know say 200 pounds, that brings you to 2600LBs plus that pin weight of 1200 totals up to 3800LBs, which does put you just barely under the max. GAWR for the rear axle. But, unless your truck weighs in at 5000 LBs or less you are going to exceed the GVWR; assuming you have the 6200 LB GVWR.

I would not be able to pull that 5th wheel with my truck, without exceeding the GVWR, you don't say what cab configuration you have. If you have a regular cab or travel about 400 LBs lighter than I do you would be able to just make it.

Keep in mind that best case you are going to be right at the limits of GVWR and/or rear GAWR. You may not be happy with your towing performance and you will be placing additional wear and tear on your truck.

The rule of thumb that I use is GCVWR - GVWR (truck) = GVWR (trailer). In my case 11 800 LBs - 6200 LBs = 5600 LBs, this is why I bought a travel trailer that has a GVWR of under 5000 LBs.

My weights:

Front Truck Axle = 2948 LBs
Rear Truck Axle = 3212 LBs
Truck Total = 6160 LBs (real close to GVWR)
Trailer Axles = 4466 LBs
Total = 10 626 LBs

[tomhole]

hotrod8 did an excellent job of explaining the different weights and especially how they interact. I wish it were simpler, but it really isn't that bad as long as you keep asking questions. Took me many months to figure it all out and I'm still learning.

I think you are going to find that the trailer you are looking at will exceed the capabilities of your Tundra, for the reasons mentioned. I have learned that 1/2 ton pickups are usually GVWR limited more than they are GCWR limted.

Tom

[MeasureMe]

Thank you for the prompt responses.

I have the access cab and it is a V8 engine. I should also mention it is a 2W drive not a 4x4.

The 5th wheel I am looking at is a 1984 Road Ranger by Kit, Model 241 (that's why I assume it is only 24ft). I will have to measure to make sure.

The GVWR for this trailer is 6290.

The GAWR for this trailer is 2179.

The tag on the door of my truck lists a GVWR of 6200 with a GAWR FRT of 3160, and a GAWR RR of 3760.

Will any of that info make any difference? It will only be me, my little dog and my cat who will be travelling.

I will be using this trailer basically for living in while I am on the road working and will probably not be moving it all that much (depends on the lengths of the construction jobs).

It kind of sounds like I would be cutting it a little close.

Also, there is a hitch included in the price for this trailer, but I will have to measure to see if it will fit.

Thanks again for any more info you can give me.

Anne

[RockyMtnRay]

Originally Posted by MeasureMe

Thank you for the prompt responses.

I have the access cab and it is a V8 engine. I should also mention it is a 2W drive not a 4x4.

The 5th wheel I am looking at is a 1984 Road Ranger by Kit, Model 241 (that's why I assume it is only 24ft). I will have to measure to make sure.

The GVWR for this trailer is 6290.

The GAWR for this trailer is 2179.

The tag on the door of my truck lists a GVWR of 6200 with a GAWR FRT of 3160, and a GAWR RR of 3760.

Will any of that info make any difference? It will only be me, my little dog and my cat who will be travelling.

I will be using this trailer basically for living in while I am on the road working and will probably not be moving it all that much (depends on the lengths of the construction jobs).

It kind of sounds like I would be cutting it a little close.

Also, there is a hitch included in the price for this trailer, but I will have to measure to see if it will fit.

Thanks again for any more info you can give me.

Anne

Anne...

Like the others above, I think you will be more than cutting it close, in all likelihood going well above the GAWR (rear) and probably GVWR of your truck.

The problem is your planned use...mostly as a "residential" usage instead of mostly as a short trip travel trailer/camper. Residential type usage means you will gradually be acquiring & stuffing a lot more things inside the trailer and its storage areas than you would be if you were loading and unloading it for each weekend trip. Simply put, "stuff" expands until you simply run out of room for more stuff. And, unfortunately, residential "stuff" like this is likely to be pretty weighty. So gradually you'll be loading the trailer well over it's actual GVWR and that means the real pin (hitch) weight on the truck will probably rise to around 1500 or even 1800 lbs. And, of course, when you do move, you'll find you have to put all the excess stuff in the bed around the hitch.

And, unfortunately, nearly all of this weight is going to be riding on the rear axle....which will be severely overloaded (probably by around 500 to 1000 lbs). If you don't actually break the rear axle or the rear springs (it's happened), you are almost guaranteed to cause very premature failure of the rear wheel bearings, probably only after a few thousand miles of towing. Your first indication will likely be wheel bearing seal failure and that will manifest itself as gear lube soaking the rear brakes and then dripping out around the rear drums. So, at a minimum, you have to replace both wheel bearings, their seals, and get a full brake job done. Not pleasant and not cheap.

And there is another problem...your Access Cab Tundra has a short (6.5 feet) bed. Unless the trailer you have in mind has an extended pin box, there's a very good chance a front corner of the trailer will collide with a rear corner of the cab during a very sharp turn (e.g. backing into a campsite or coming out of a gas station). You can get special hitches that allow the pin to move backwards during sharp turns but they are very expensive (automatic) or quite fiddly (manual).

My personal view is nobody should try to tow a 5th wheel with a GVWR over 4500 lbs with a Tundra. You just don't have enough spare rear axle carrying capacity. And, unfortunately, there are mighty few (if any) 5th wheels with GVWRs in the low 4000lb range that have enough interior room to be comfortable for extended stay, residential style living. However, if you were to choose one of the longer, ultralight construction conventional travel trailers, you could safely pull it with your Tundra if you used a really good weight distributing hitch. With the right hitch (Reese dual cam or Hensley Arrow), you probably could get a fairly spacious 27 to 29 foot trailer with a 5600 to 6000 lb GVWR and still stay within your truck's limits. The key is the hitch...it must properly distribute the tongue weight between the trucks' front and rear axles (to prevent overloading either) and it must be very capable of controlling the incipient sway of such a long trailer with the relatively short wheelbase of your truck. The Hensley hitch would definitely do this but at $3000 is kinda spendy; the Reese Dual Cam (at around $600) probably would be sufficient for a 27 foot trailer.

[MeasureMe]

Thank you for the extra information. I think I am going to go looking for a bumper pull now. I don't want to take any chances.

Ray, I know what you mean about accumulating stuff, but I have been this route before, moving from job to job. I will still have my home base in CA. The trailer is only to cut down on living expenses while on the road. Hotels tend to cut into your per diem.

I am so sorry I got rid of my previous rig: a 35 ft Avion. I never hauled it, though. I hired a hauler, and since most of my jobs were in CA, it didn't cost that much.