Are you sure it was the CR survey and not the JD Powers, cause that's about the time I got the JD, in a thick white envelope.
I would think the CR would want someone to own the vehicle for more than a month or 2 before acquiring this kind of data.
The whole mess just stinks of some sort of mistake by CR.
__________________
Beer please! CBTMA (Member and Founding Father: Est. August 15, 2008)
Clicky>>> What The Heck is CBTMA
Unknown - "The biological purpose of pain is to prevent the recurrence of stupidity."
I think I got one in March or April...but did not fill it out...can't remember exactly when it was.
Sooooo, happy people don't complain... pissed folks do. This would skew any results towards problems. Plus, if the truck came out in Febuary and the surveys were in March/April that would make for a very small sample rate... I'm starting to see the big picture here.
CR just tabulates the results of ACTUAL owner surveys for their results.
There is no Shenanigans or Monkey Business. There is no reason to hate.
Trust me.
They are legit and they have a very fair and incorruptible evaluation procedure.
Did you even look at these two tables?
How did that black dot get there at the bottom of the 2007 4WD column?
Why the huge discrepancies between identical items?
Why have there been exactly zero reported 4WD problems on this site?
I've never seen such blind acceptance of something so questionable.
There is a reason to "hate" because this will absolutely affect the resale value of my truck down the road.
I am sitting on a survey that I have had for about 2 months and still not filled out. It is from a company called "Pearson Assessments" Titled "New Vehicle Research Study".
It wants me to mark any problem areas on my truck and lists about 220 items to check if they are a problem. At the end, it has a small section on satisfaction and who I am (height, weight, age, sex "yes please").
Has anyone heard of these people or who they are conducting the survey for? Could this report to CR? Could my NOT filling it out and sending it in, skew their results?
I should get it filled out I suppose since I got one of the perfect
Tundras that is not plagued with even one of the issues reported on this forum.
__________________
Beer please! CBTMA (Member and Founding Father: Est. August 15, 2008)
Clicky>>> What The Heck is CBTMA
Unknown - "The biological purpose of pain is to prevent the recurrence of stupidity."
Are you sure it was the CR survey and not the JD Powers, cause that's about the time I got the JD, in a thick white envelope.
I would think the CR would want someone to own the vehicle for more than a month or 2 before acquiring this kind of data.
The whole mess just stinks of some sort of mistake by CR.
Yeah...I remember it was CR...but I was travelling quite a bit at the time...and it got pushed aside and forgotten.
__________________
2007 5.7L Tundra CrewMax Ltd 4x4 in Radiant Red
How did that black dot get there at the bottom of the 2007 4WD column?
Why the huge discrepancies between identical items?
Why have there been exactly zero reported 4WD problems on this site?
I've never seen such blind acceptance of something so questionable.
There is a reason to "hate" because this will absolutely affect the resale value of my truck down the road.
There is an explanation of how to read the CR charts on Page 9, Post #126, on this thread.
You won't have to worry about your trucks resale value. CR rates the Tundra highest for truck depreciation and highest in owner satisfaction. You will still get higher resale with your Tundra than you would with a Big 3 truck.
We have a pretty good representation of '07 Tundra owners on this forum. Could someone set up a simple poll of '07 owners who are CR subscribers and whether or not they submitted a survey. It would be interesting to see the numbers.
(I would post a poll but have no clue how to, even poked my nose around FAQ's etc.)
The report is flawed, plain and simple. Regardless of what they are reviewing, I would question those results of 2 products that are essentially the same. For example, how does "Body Hardware" score best in 2WD and worst in 4WD? That makes absolutely ZERO sense. That one category alone proves the report is flawed. IT'S THE SAME TRUCK!
[quote=AlaskaCub;797134]I can make any assumption I want especially informed assumptions. I worked at this Toyota Dealership and I know people who work at this Toyota dealership now. Ours does not buy used vehicles at auction like in the lower 48. They also dont keep older rigs at all, they get wholesaled immediately. Whats on the lot is what has come in on trade, thats how it works at the dealership in my garage.
You are probably close about the % of loyal repeat Toyota owners but this is the first time that Toyota has put out a real truck in the 1/2 ton market and I know for a fact that many of the new Tundra owners also test drove GM's Fords and Dodges before settling on the Tundra and thats where you and your GM buddy slim keep deciding to spin my statements about 100,000 BIG 3 owners switching to toyota, which is not what I said. I was referring to the number of people that test drove other 1/2 ton trucks made by the Big 3 before settling on the Tundra.
Your statement about the vast majority of truck buyers buying domestic when buying a truck (assuming your talking about 1/2 tons since Toyota doesn't make the big trucks 3/4 and 1 tns) that trend is probably correct as well for past years but then again how many years has Toyota been making a real 1/2 ton truck.....less than 1 ??? You can spin everybody's statements on thsi forum but your efforts are in vane in convincing me of chit. As for the Dodge, ho wmany miles do you have and what kind of work do you even do with it? Mne had 110,000 miles and this box I am typing in isn't big enough to type all the work that was done to my Dodge. Complete front end suspension rebuidls every 30,000 miles, seals leaking after each and eveyr winter, u-joints breaking, carrier bearing failure, steering gear boxes replaced every 50,000 miles, P/S hoses that leaked, oil pan gaskets, I mean how much money do you put into a truck as it begins to disintegrate on you. The Dodge with a Cummins in my opinion is the best of the Big 3 for real HD use but that does not come without a price over time. I have just a little xperience using HD trucks for what they were designed to do, that I can assure you. Heres a few pics of my Dodges that I have owned and what I did with them.[quote]
I think you may be exaggerating a tad, because if it was as bad as you say then I don't see why you kept them long enough to put any miles on them, let alone buy more than one.
My truck has 50K miles on it right now and it has been flawless with the exception of a bad lift pump which was covered under warranty. I use it as a truck should be used, but I'm not going to run the crap out of it as a hot shotter and and then complain that it has problems. Hook that car hauler up to that Tundra (or any truck) for a few thousand miles and see if the repair bills don't start adding up.
I'll give credit where credit is due, and the new Tundra is an awesome truck and Toyota makes a great product- there's no doubt about any of that.
You guys just need to face the facts though and it just appears to be too much for some to admit that many people are totally happy with other brands and not evey Tundra is perfect. The big 3 outsell Toyota in the truck market because MORE people like their offerings better for whatever reason, not because there's more dealerships, LOL!
Now everyone is pissed at CR. Just accept the fact that your truck is not perfect and quit putting the crosshairs on anyone that might suggest otherwise. Every manufacturer makes a great truck these days and millions of people love their trucks even if they are not a Yota. I used to be just like you guys concerning Toyota products, but I grew up and I realized that this is an arguement that can't be won and more importantly, nobody really even cares. Just buy what you like and let others do the same, there's no point in being a grown man and degrading another man's vehicle, unless you are insecure. JMO.
I think the reality of the matter is that though CR does a pretty good job at rating vehicles as they are, that trying to predict reliability is just very subjective. Certainly one can use a host of scientific measures based on materials, use, past history, etc, but none of that seems to be evident here.
And again the keyword here is “predicted” reliability… though, as others have mentioned, it would have been better if they just said that this info was unavailable since it is a new model.
On another note, I don’t see why there is all this hostility towards other truck brands. Just because the Tundra is a great truck, doesn’t mean that the others aren’t good as well. I really liked the leather in the Chevy and the auto-AWD and flip-up seat in the crew-cab and the locking differential. The column shifter stunk and so did the use of space and the fact that it was a 4-speed, but it was still a great truck. I think that people’s past experiences are going to motivate them to go in one direction or another anyway.
To previous comments about sales numbers… the Tundra is certainly selling to many that had domestics before. The 40-20-40 numbers cited by Toyota corp are pretty accurate, even when looking at previous sales numbers because the big increase in sales when all others are declining (due in part to the drop in housing construction and the like) show that out of the approx 160K trucks sold so far, that 65K being previous Tundra owners, 65K being previous Detroit3 truck owners, and 30K being “new” truck owners is about right since the difference between sales so far (from February on) have already greatly eclipsed sales from last year at just over 120K trucks. With 4 fewer months in sales right now and a 33% higher sales figure than all of last year in a bad market shows that many truck buyers are coming from the domestics. Combine that with lower domestic sales than last year and it shouldn’t be too hard to see that when the numbers for all the 07 sales are done, probably 75K to 80K of them will have gone to previous Detroit3 owners.
One last note about the CR study that I had to laugh at… it rated gas mileage for the Tundra as pretty bad. But every comparison test done, from Car and Driver, to edmunds, to R&T shows that the Tundra was better than the competition and was overall closer to their EPA ratings. I’m averaging around 17 to 17.5 driving around 50/50 highway/city and around the DC beltway, sometimes you just sit there or maybe roll at 5mph. I have neighbors with Nissans, Fords, GMs and all of them get worse mileage. So, I don’t know where they get their stats from or if it is just relative to the whole vehicle mix, but certainly this 5.7 engine is doing well in this area…
Trust me.. $$$ trumps all, and at the end of the day.. Its the advertising that pays CR's bills.
So...have you every actually opened a CR magazine? If you have, you would realize that this statement is just plain wrong. CR does not accept advertising, and buys all of the products that it tests. It does not accept demo units from manufacturers for test.
Now, I may not like the current CR ratings on the Tundra, as I think that "predicted reliability" on a totally new platform is akin to mind reading. But what I really hate it when people write things that are just plain wrong and state them as fact.
So, let me repeat...CR DOES NOT ACCEPT ADVERTISING. Just go to the book store and browse through an issue to see for yourself. They survive through magazine sales and subscriptions to their web site.
__________________
2007 5.7L Tundra CrewMax Ltd 4x4 in Radiant Red
[QUOTE=slice;797431][quote=AlaskaCub;797134]I can make any assumption I want especially informed assumptions. I worked at this Toyota Dealership and I know people who work at this Toyota dealership now. Ours does not buy used vehicles at auction like in the lower 48. They also dont keep older rigs at all, they get wholesaled immediately. Whats on the lot is what has come in on trade, thats how it works at the dealership in my garage.
You are probably close about the % of loyal repeat Toyota owners but this is the first time that Toyota has put out a real truck in the 1/2 ton market and I know for a fact that many of the new Tundra owners also test drove GM's Fords and Dodges before settling on the Tundra and thats where you and your GM buddy slim keep deciding to spin my statements about 100,000 BIG 3 owners switching to toyota, which is not what I said. I was referring to the number of people that test drove other 1/2 ton trucks made by the Big 3 before settling on the Tundra.
Your statement about the vast majority of truck buyers buying domestic when buying a truck (assuming your talking about 1/2 tons since Toyota doesn't make the big trucks 3/4 and 1 tns) that trend is probably correct as well for past years but then again how many years has Toyota been making a real 1/2 ton truck.....less than 1 ??? You can spin everybody's statements on thsi forum but your efforts are in vane in convincing me of chit. As for the Dodge, ho wmany miles do you have and what kind of work do you even do with it? Mne had 110,000 miles and this box I am typing in isn't big enough to type all the work that was done to my Dodge. Complete front end suspension rebuidls every 30,000 miles, seals leaking after each and eveyr winter, u-joints breaking, carrier bearing failure, steering gear boxes replaced every 50,000 miles, P/S hoses that leaked, oil pan gaskets, I mean how much money do you put into a truck as it begins to disintegrate on you. The Dodge with a Cummins in my opinion is the best of the Big 3 for real HD use but that does not come without a price over time. I have just a little xperience using HD trucks for what they were designed to do, that I can assure you. Heres a few pics of my Dodges that I have owned and what I did with them.
Quote:
I think you may be exaggerating a tad, because if it was as bad as you say then I don't see why you kept them long enough to put any miles on them, let alone buy more than one.
My truck has 50K miles on it right now and it has been flawless with the exception of a bad lift pump which was covered under warranty. I use it as a truck should be used, but I'm not going to run the crap out of it as a hot shotter and and then complain that it has problems. Hook that car hauler up to that Tundra (or any truck) for a few thousand miles and see if the repair bills don't start adding up.
I'll give credit where credit is due, and the new Tundra is an awesome truck and Toyota makes a great product- there's no doubt about any of that.
You guys just need to face the facts though and it just appears to be too much for some to admit that many people are totally happy with other brands and not evey Tundra is perfect. The big 3 outsell Toyota in the truck market because MORE people like their offerings better for whatever reason, not because there's more dealerships, LOL!
Now everyone is pissed at CR. Just accept the fact that your truck is not perfect and quit putting the crosshairs on anyone that might suggest otherwise. Every manufacturer makes a great truck these days and millions of people love their trucks even if they are not a Yota. I used to be just like you guys concerning Toyota products, but I grew up and I realized that this is an arguement that can't be won and more importantly, nobody really even cares. Just buy what you like and let others do the same, there's no point in being a grown man and degrading another man's vehicle, unless you are insecure. JMO.
I agree with ya 100%. In light of the few cam shaft failures, tranny problems, and other issues that I read right here on this forum, are you really surprised that it got the rating it did. Also, as I read it, they're not gonna give toyota anymore free passes, if you will, based on toyotas past. To me, that's the real kick in the nuts.
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