Consmer Reports Threads Merged

[shadyskins]

Originally Posted by mxsjw

It would be nice if a link was provided to this information or is it locked for CR subscribers only?

MXSJW - this is not the consumer reports article.... but it refers to it....

Toyota slips in Consumer Reports' reliability rankings - Oct. 16, 2007

[AlaskaCub]

Originally Posted by cliff clavin

looking at the graph (on consumer reports website) the 2 wheel drive is practically at the top and the 4 wheel drive is near the bottom......I have a hard time understanding what the difference between the two could account for the large difference in ratings......I did not think the camshaft, transmission or torque converter issues affected only 4 wheel drive and not the 2???

You are correct and I am telling you its because they want a truck that rides like a car, thats also what GM has been after for a while now.

[Cliffy1]

This is what happens when pointy headed geeks evaluate a truck. Its typical of CR and doesn't surprise me in the least. Take a look at the comments and notice that they obviously have no concept about what a full sized truck is about. It has horrible mileage, even though its better than the rest. It has poor brakes, except when compared to everything else. It has a "jittery" ride with the OF package but I defy them to actually prove that one. They don't like part-time 4WD and think Toyota made a big mistake equipping the truck with such system.

Are these guys high? Do they sit around in a room, pretending their farts smell like fresh baked biscuts?

I don't mind real criticism. If you want to knock the Tundra for its payload capacity, fine. If you want to knock it because it has more plastic on the dash than you would like, have at it. If you back up claims about bed bounce when done under controlled conditions against similar trucks, its all yours. However, criticizing it for being better in braking and fuel economy because it doesn't match your undefined goals is absurd. Not recognizing the purpose behind the part time system and ignoring the technical benefits of the A-trac and auto LSD is just ridiculous.

[sticksnstonesrus]

Originally Posted by Cliffy1

This is what happens when pointy headed geeks evaluate a truck. Its typical of CR and doesn't surprise me in the least. Take a look at the comments and notice that they obviously have no concept about what a full sized truck is about. It has horrible mileage, even though its better than the rest. It has poor brakes, except when compared to everything else. It has a "jittery" ride with the OF package but I defy them to actually prove that one. They don't like part-time 4WD and think Toyota made a big mistake equipping the truck with such system.

Are these guys high? Do they sit around in a room, pretending their farts smell like fresh baked biscuts?

I don't mind real criticism. If you want to knock the Tundra for its payload capacity, fine. If you want to knock it because it has more plastic on the dash than you would like, have at it. If you back up claims about bed bounce when done under controlled conditions against similar trucks, its all yours. However, criticizing it for being better in braking and fuel economy because it doesn't match your undefined goals is absurd. Not recognizing the purpose behind the part time system and ignoring the technical benefits of the A-trac and auto LSD is just ridiculous.

Well said. I so very much agree.

[bgil]

Originally Posted by rockstate45

Not necessarily. He cited his sources.

That sucks though that the reliability is not very good though. Kinda disappointed about that.

-rockstate

I have to agree that this recommendation sucks. It will show up in the monthly magazine shortly, and really get attention. I have followed this website since Feburary, and I must say I am not suprised at the comments.
There has just been too many posts about transmission problems, rough ride, etc.. You don't see these kinds of consistant complaints when you read the gm truck websites. They simply should not be an issue.

I have had zero problems with my tundra (8200 miles) and it has been very nice to drive. I have added 200 pounds of sack gravel in the back to settle it down.

I buy new trucks every few years, and next time I will look very seriously at GM, ford and dodge. THey all have new platforms and are worth consideration. Toyota had better focus on these issues and correct them or many others will take their money elsewhere.

[TacoWillie]

FIRST,
This will NOT change me from placing my order for a 2008, but it's exactly why I've waited till the second year model to come out.
ALOT, of the complaints pointed out, are threads I've seen here MANY times on this and other Forums. Don't deny that this rig has had problems, just accept it. Everyone takes a chance buying the the first year so they can get attention and say they have one of the NEW models that everyone wants....NOW, it's up to Toyota to get the CRAP worked out of these trucks and make things right.
I know even in the second year, there will still be ALOT of room for improvement in this truck, but I still want one.
So, all of you guys need to quit denying the truth. This truck "ain't" perfect, but it's the only truck for me right now...........

Second,
FlatironsDreamer, lose the "I'm gonna tell, you copied" BS. It should have been outgrown in 5th grade........Let sticksnstonesrus worry about if he is breaking copyright laws. He's expressing his freedom of information to the people. You ought to thank him!

THIRD,
The candy@ss city slickers that rated this truck have probably never been off-road recreationally or to hunt, so they don't know that a truck is supposed to be rough, tough, and rugged. If you're going to be a pansy and complain about a rough ride and part-time 4WD, you should be driving a Buick so "your tushy won't hurt and the ride won't be so crude"....

Good Lord, what has happened to this country?!?! It's turned into a bunch of soft, latte' drinking whiners that are so PC they've lost their roots!!!

I'm off my soapbox now.......Thank you.

[paulphilly]

Originally Posted by Cliffy1

This is what happens when pointy headed geeks evaluate a truck. Its typical of CR and doesn't surprise me in the least. Take a look at the comments and notice that they obviously have no concept about what a full sized truck is about. It has horrible mileage, even though its better than the rest. It has poor brakes, except when compared to everything else. It has a "jittery" ride with the OF package but I defy them to actually prove that one. They don't like part-time 4WD and think Toyota made a big mistake equipping the truck with such system.

Are these guys high? Do they sit around in a room, pretending their farts smell like fresh baked biscuts?

I don't mind real criticism. If you want to knock the Tundra for its payload capacity, fine. If you want to knock it because it has more plastic on the dash than you would like, have at it. If you back up claims about bed bounce when done under controlled conditions against similar trucks, its all yours. However, criticizing it for being better in braking and fuel economy because it doesn't match your undefined goals is absurd. Not recognizing the purpose behind the part time system and ignoring the technical benefits of the A-trac and auto LSD is just ridiculous.

Nicely said! Its important for us to remember that these articles are MOSTLY subjective. And, I would guess that the opinions given are fueled by political interest and coercion! Seriously, if I am a "geek" working for CR and am rewarded by political interests for bashing a certain product, then why wouldnt I if the product in question has no sentimental meaning. Most of the time, the individuals responsible for writing the article has not even owned a pickup truck, much less spent any time inside the Tundra. Is the Tundra perfect? Of course not, but its the best 1/2 ton that the market currently offers. Would I buy a Chevy, Ford, or Nissan if there were better? Yes because I work hard for my money and want to be a smart buyer. BUT, right now the Tundra is by far the better truck amongst its competitors. Oh, had 2 Nissan Titans....both were the biggest pieces of crap ever built...that is a fact!

[vroten]

On a corporate level this is very big. Perception is almost more important than reality in the car business today. Toyota needs to work on the PR or it could find itself in the position that has been that of the American manufacturers, claiming to build a quality product to the ears of a deaf public.

On a personal level, this is no biggie. (except maybe for resale/glad I leased) If you got a reliable truck, you got a reliable truck. EVERYBODY makes good and bad. After coming out of 3 previous Silverados with great experiences I could care less what CR's opinion of GM was.

[FlatironsDreamer]

Originally Posted by TacoWillie

FIRST,
Second,
FlatironsDreamer, lose the "I'm gonna tell, you copied" BS. It should have been outgrown in 5th grade........Let sticksnstonesrus worry about if he is breaking copyright laws. He's expressing his freedom of information to the people. You ought to thank him!

I'm off my soapbox now.......Thank you.

Thanks for the lecture. But as a writer I value copyright, and understand that CR has a right to limit reproduction. I also don't want this site to come down because of infringement - but you wouldn't understand.

[sticksnstonesrus]

Originally Posted by FlatironsDreamer

Thanks for the lecture. But as a writer I value copyright, and understand that CR has a right to limit reproduction. I also don't want this site to come down because of infringement - but you wouldn't understand.

My .02 on this.

Public airing ones personal, unsubstatiated, opinions...while completely your given right on a public forum, can be distasteful if directed solely at one member...when the rest gain no benefit from the post.

Positive, negative, neutral....fine.

Personal - send a PM. I do.

Thanks

[StatCoder]

Originally Posted by paulphilly

Its important for us to remember that these articles are MOSTLY subjective. Oh, had 2 Nissan Titans....both were the biggest pieces of crap ever built...that is a fact!

OK, so the CR reliability surveys are subjective and your opinion of the two Titans you owned is fact. I'm glad we got that straight.

Well, it's too bad that resale values are going to take a hit. It's too bad that the fall of Toyota's quality rating is going to make the media big time and it's too bad that I'm going to get sh*t from my friends who know I bought a new Tundra.

I just went to the parking lot to look at my truck and it didn't turn into a piece of sh*t just yet.

At least we won't have to listen to the "It's a Toyota" bullsh*t from salesman and others who are trying to justify higher prices for sales, parts, and service. I never said anything like that so I don't have any crow to eat.

Finally, some of you owe an apology to the guy who posted some of the advance information from a CR insider because he got royally flamed. I think he did some of us a favor by letting us know this might be coming. If I were getting ready to buy a Tundra, I would still buy one but I would have this info in hand when the salesman started feeding me this line about how hot this new 2008 Tundra is going to be and how he might be able to knock off $1000 off MSRP.

[jk1972]

Well, I own both the Tundra Limited 4x4 TRD Crewmax and a 2007 Camry (it's the 4-banger though)... But I also own a Toshiba 42 inch plasma and about 20 other items that I've never had a problem with and Consumer Reports rates as a unreliable. I don't put a whole lot of weight into what they say.

The only problems I've had with my two vehicles were caused by the dealership and Toyota Corporate gave me a $250 coupon for my troubles. I bought my vehicles because they are Toyotas and I know if something is wrong, they'll fix it. My wife owned a 2001 Suburban that was the biggest lemon you've ever seen or heard of and Chevy never offered us a penny for our troubles.

I try to buy from companies that stand by their products. That's why now only own Toyota and it's all I'll ever own.

4300 miles and counting on the Tundra. If something happens to it, I'll be upset but I also know that it'll be taken care of.

[rmcrox]

It would be interesting to see what the GM forums say about this. When CR rated the Tundra as their number one truck for 07, all of the GMers were moaning and groaning. It would really say something about their credibility if the same people that were moaning and groaning about how CR is biased were to use the same source that they discredited (earlier this year) as a reliable source now that they can use the information to their advantage.

[el_madmaster]

It is because they don't recommend the V8 - apparently the 5.7 cam or crankshaft failures were noted highly by CR. They recommend the 4x2 more b/c the V6 version only comes in 4x2. They're rating by different engines, not just drivetrain systems.

I remember a couple weeks ago someone said that they knew someone who worked for CR that said the Tundra would not be rated well, and everyone yelled troll. Ahem.

[longwoodklon]

Originally Posted by StatCoder

OK, so the CR reliability surveys are subjective and your opinion of the two Titans you owned is fact. I'm glad we got that straight.

Well, it's too bad that resale values are going to take a hit. It's too bad that the fall of Toyota's quality rating is going to make the media big time and it's too bad that I'm going to get sh*t from my friends who know I bought a new Tundra.

I just went to the parking lot to look at my truck and it didn't turn into a piece of sh*t just yet.

At least we won't have to listen to the "It's a Toyota" bullsh*t from salesman and others who are trying to justify higher prices for sales, parts, and service. I never said anything like that so I don't have any crow to eat.

Finally, some of you owe an apology to the guy who posted some of the advance information from a CR insider because he got royally flamed. I think he did some of us a favor by letting us know this might be coming. If I were getting ready to buy a Tundra, I would still buy one but I would have this info in hand when the salesman started feeding me this line about how hot this new 2008 Tundra is going to be and how he might be able to knock off $1000 off MSRP.

I agree 100% with these statements. Look, Toyota makes a great product, but they are NOT perfect. And there quality has suffered in direct proportion to their sales increases.

It's these attitudes that '<insert company name here>' is the greatest and justifying any critical reviews as biased, that lead to the decline of the big 3 and it can happen to any company that thinks they don't need to improve. I sincerely hope that this type of review will give Toyota a kick in the A$$ and make them start paying attention again.

Discredit CR all you want, but when they were bashing on all the domestics everyone here used them as proof. CR does have many subjective points in their review. But I think the jittery ride(bed bouncing?) is legit. But bottom line, I'm sure they would have Recommended it had the reliability been average or higher. They simply will NOT recommend a vehicle with below average reliability.
/Mike