I agree, not an hour after doing the mod a minivan tried to back out in front of me and got an earful, you could see both the driver and passenger jump... very loud!! can't wait to fire it off in the parking garage today tat work.
This afternoon I tried the Stebel with the Low tone stock horn and then with the High tone stock horn. I have to say I prefer the mixture of the HIGH tone stock horn with Stebel. It is really loud and it truly does have the exact tone of a train. The way the Stebel comes in just a milisecond late even sounds like a train. My girlfriend couldn't stop laughing at how much my Tundra now sounds like a train. I was doing the typical long blow followed by two short ones that trains typically sound and she said the people in the apartments we were driving past were going to wonder how come they'd never noticed the tracks by their place. Pretty dang funny!!!
it is best to not try and correct someone unless you are 100% sure you are correct decibels are logarithmic, so a 10 dB increase = twice the volume. but what do i know, i've only competed in stereo competitions since i was 16 (11 years now) and was an IASCA judge for several years as well
I think I can clear this up. A 3db increase, NOT a 10 db increase, IS actually a doubling of the sound power level logarithmically. However, what you are referring to is the human component, i.e., a human typically perceives a 10db increase as a doubling of the volume.
The other thing that is interesting is how humans perceive low tones. A 300 hz tone at 134 db will be perceived as lower in volume than a 2000 hz tone at teh same db level. "A weighting" is typically used to account for this phenomenom.
I think I can clear this up. A 3db increase, NOT a 10 db increase, IS actually a doubling of the sound power level logarithmically. However, what you are referring to is the human component, i.e., a human typically perceives a 10db increase as a doubling of the volume.
The other thing that is interesting is how humans perceive low tones. A 300 hz tone at 134 db will be perceived as lower in volume than a 2000 hz tone at teh same db level. "A weighting" is typically used to account for this phenomenom.
yup. but nowhere did i say the "sound power level". i stated twice as loud would require a 10 dB increase.
looking at the different natilus horns stebel offers, i would say they use the same diaphragm and very similar horns, however the 300 hz horn isn't as loud as the higher freq horns because it is at a lower freq. i'd be interested to see what a 600 hz horn does with the 300 hz horn.
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2.4" front/1" rear leveling kit - toyo A/T 285/75/18 tires - bull bar with hella 500FF lights - 20% tint side and back windows - 55% full windshield tint
in the works:
stock HU -> LOC -> PPI FRX-456 -> DLS A4 + Marathon 6150 -> DLS iridium 6.2 comps + Hybrid-Audio L3's + 4 Tang Band W6-1139SI's
to come:
JBL MS-8 + center channel speaker + components for the rear + sirius adapter for stock HU
it is best to not try and correct someone unless you are 100% sure you are correct decibels are logarithmic, so a 10 dB increase = twice the volume. but what do i know, i've only competed in stereo competitions since i was 16 (11 years now) and was an IASCA judge for several years as well
that is correct. a 3 dB increase could require the same power with double the drivers (in reference to speakers). speaking from a subwoofer perspective, if you where to double the number of subs and doubled the power supply (second amp, or an amp that is twice as powerful), it equates to about a 6 dB increase. however, those are only generalizations. the higher you go, the harder it is to increase the loudness/dB's, since it is not perfectly linear.
Well, I thought the whole point of boards was to share information -- if everyone already knew everything, than there would be no point in having these discussions. So, with that, I'm not picking on anybody, and certainly not trying to pick a fight, but in the spirit of a good discussion, I gotta say that anybody that knows anything about speaker building and getting a nice flat response from their crossovers knows that it is pretty much accepted that a 3dB increase/decrease means double the volume. Look at charts from even the pros and you'll see that they all strive for a flat response for a well-balanced speaker -- usually nothing more than 1 or 2 dBs difference across the entire spectrum (in a 2 or 3 way speaker) for anything resembling a professional product.
I'm not going to debate whether this is applicable to horns or not, but people should know at least what is accepted as industry standard. Even the SPL meter did its job and made the point. All I'm saying is that whether or not you "feel" like its double the volume, a 3dB increase is considered as such. This will avoid a lot of confusion when you talk with others about more important things like your truck's speakers and amplifiers.
Your subwoofer example is greatly simplified... you're not saying whether the subwoofers are independent arrangements, connected in series or in parallel and how that affects your resistance and power requirements from your amplifier (i.e. ~ 1,2,4, or 8 ohms depending on, again, your arrangement). But I do get your point. I'm just saying, our ears may not confirm what tools designed for this purpose confirm. Two independent horns should be 3dB greater than one and that was confirmed. It may not "feel" like that to us, but much like an earthquake, a 3.6 (on the Richter scale) doesn't feel like it is double the power of a 3.5 earthquake, but it is. I'm not a retail custom-speaker designer and I don't do SPL competitions as I prefer quality of sound, not quantity. Don't take my word for it though, check out Wikipedia or get on the boards at audioholics and make your case (I've been there for 8 years now).
I agree, not an hour after doing the mod a minivan tried to back out in front of me and got an earful, you could see both the driver and passenger jump... very loud!! can't wait to fire it off in the parking garage today tat work.
Don't know how many people remember the earlier post of the guys at hornblasters, but if you want a good laugh, take a look at some of the video clips there... one of the clips in particular show an entire group of maybe 80 people or so eating at an outdoor restaurant all jump about a foot out of their seats! Yeah, it seems like they can be real jerks, but I gotta admit that it was pretty funny... don't know what happened after they got the cop though, the video was promptly "cut-off".
Well, I thought the whole point of boards was to share information -- if everyone already knew everything, than there would be no point in having these discussions. So, with that, I'm not picking on anybody, and certainly not trying to pick a fight, but in the spirit of a good discussion, I gotta say that anybody that knows anything about speaker building and getting a nice flat response from their crossovers knows that it is pretty much accepted that a 3dB increase/decrease means double the volume. Look at charts from even the pros and you'll see that they all strive for a flat response for a well-balanced speaker -- usually nothing more than 1 or 2 dBs difference across the entire spectrum (in a 2 or 3 way speaker) for anything resembling a professional product.
I'm not going to debate whether this is applicable to horns or not, but people should know at least what is accepted as industry standard. Even the SPL meter did its job and made the point. All I'm saying is that whether or not you "feel" like its double the volume, a 3dB increase is considered as such. This will avoid a lot of confusion when you talk with others about more important things like your truck's speakers and amplifiers.
Your subwoofer example is greatly simplified... you're not saying whether the subwoofers are independent arrangements, connected in series or in parallel and how that affects your resistance and power requirements from your amplifier (i.e. ~ 1,2,4, or 8 ohms depending on, again, your arrangement). But I do get your point. I'm just saying, our ears may not confirm what tools designed for this purpose confirm. Two independent horns should be 3dB greater than one and that was confirmed. It may not "feel" like that to us, but much like an earthquake, a 3.6 (on the Richter scale) doesn't feel like it is double the power of a 3.5 earthquake, but it is. I'm not a retail custom-speaker designer and I don't do SPL competitions as I prefer quality of sound, not quantity. Don't take my word for it though, check out Wikipedia or get on the boards at audioholics and make your case (I've been there for 8 years now).
a 3 dB increase does not mean double the volume. i don't know of anyone, besides you, who considers it double the volume. a 1 dB difference isn't even enough of a difference for most people to hear there is a difference. click the link Swatdude1 posted. here's a quote taken right from it, so you can't say that it was from some link have:
"Experimentally it was found that a 10 dB increase in sound level corresponds approximately to a perceived doubling of loudness."
twice as much power is 3 dB's, but that does not equate to twice the loudness or volume.
i'm not about to use wiki for a reference, since there is plenty of incorrect information on there. i've been on car audio forums for years, so that is nothing new. anyone on there that says 3 dB's is twice the volume/loudness, i wouldn't take any of their advice. i'll stick to the 12volt insiders forum since carsound is getting dead these days.
but feel free to post a thread asking if in fact 10 dB's equates to about twice the volume to someone who knows what they are talking about. i usually keep my discussions between engineers and manufacturers.
the subwoofer comparison removes the variables and simply compares cone area and wattage only for the purpose of easy comparison.
and in reference to SQ, i've been doing that for years, since i stopped SPL competition after i destroyed my old car. and a few years of judging SQ comps, i know a thing or two about it.
__________________
2.4" front/1" rear leveling kit - toyo A/T 285/75/18 tires - bull bar with hella 500FF lights - 20% tint side and back windows - 55% full windshield tint
in the works:
stock HU -> LOC -> PPI FRX-456 -> DLS A4 + Marathon 6150 -> DLS iridium 6.2 comps + Hybrid-Audio L3's + 4 Tang Band W6-1139SI's
to come:
JBL MS-8 + center channel speaker + components for the rear + sirius adapter for stock HU
well... I was waiting to hear the success stories in this forum... and I like what I hear. I just ordered mine from the dude on ebay (he's got a bunch more listed at $49.95 with $9 shipping). Thanks everyone for the install tips and sound clips!
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. 2007 TUNDRA 5.7L SR5 TRD 4x2 Double Cab, Salsa Red Pearl
TRD CAI, Corsa Sport Side Exit Dual Tip Exhaust, Stebel 300Hz Air Horn, OEM Tundra Mud Mats, Black powder-coated side-step bars, Ventshades, Line-X, TRD Sway Bar, Blacked headlights surround, White LED guage and dash lights, Viper 771VXR Remote Start / Alarm, Carriage Works black billet grille with logo remount (awaiting install).
well... I was waiting to hear the success stories in this forum... and I like what I hear. I just ordered mine from the dude on ebay (he's got a bunch more listed at $49.95 with $9 shipping). Thanks everyone for the install tips and sound clips!
Thanks for posting that he had more, I was checking last night and nothing...got mine ordered today.
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Beer please! CBTMA (Member and Founding Father: Est. August 15, 2008)
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Re: New Stebel 300 Hz Truck Horn
decibels are logarithmic, so a 10 dB increase = twice the volume. but what do i know, i've only competed in stereo competitions since i was 16 (11 years now) and was an IASCA judge for several years as well 
Took all of 15 minutes to do.
Linear Mode
