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Jedi Ninja in Training
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My wife says I evolved from this...

:devil:
My wife just walked by and slapped the sh!t out of me for smiling while looking at a picture of a jackass when I was itchin' my junk.
 

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Leader of Group Evil
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If you think parts are wrong how can you believe any of it? Do you just pick out the things you like and the rest they got wrong? What makes God "God" if he didn't create us? To believe in both is very confusing. :rolleyes:
It's not like that, not at all.

The Scientific Method in a nutshell means you theorize how something might work, then observe to see how closely your idea matches with reality, and refine the theory. The theory doesn't have to be correct at first, it evolves toward a better answer. We do indeed pick the things we like, or in this case what works better, and reject what fails...just like the Protestant reformation. Religion a la carte is a corollary to the theorize-test-refine basis of the scientific method.

Dogma requires that you believe something because it must be believed, and tries its often-illogical best to resist change. It requires that you accept it all without question, and reject it all if you accept the smallest inconsistency. Religion is full of inconsistencies, but do you reject all faith? Nope! Those inconsistencies are trivial compared to the big picture, just like the many inconsistencies in any scientific theory...they are refined over time. The people who can't accept that are the ones we find baking pieces of wood in their ovens, trying to fake proof of Noah's Ark. The ones who can accept change and refinement are the ones currently digging up the Middle East (what's not being blown up :rolleyes: ) trying to learn more about the roots of Christianity and older religions :tu:...that's history, and I think it's fascinating.

Even religion changes. Locking your mind to the beliefs of one denomination (or one religion) and rejecting all others out of hand ignores the many good things that can come from a different way of thinking.

I think religion and reason can coexist. In fact, I think they must coexist for humanity to evolve beyond Flat Earths and the Heliocentric Universe, holy wars, the Auto de Fe, etc...religion in its various forms provides a moral anchor. Reason lets us examine ourselves and our religions and choose when either must be refined...like the Athenians, or the evolution of Christianity from older religions, and even the evolution of various denominations of Christianity. Evolution is nothing to be afraid of...even if it proves that most guys are barely evolved from jackasses :clown:.

I don't think it's hard to swallow "do unto others as you'd have done to you", or however you prefer to translate it, but we're beyond the flat earth...evolution in action! and it didn't require me to reject the "Golden Rule". Link is to Wiki article on the Ethic of Reciprocity, found in many religions and certainly not rejected by any scientist I know :).

-Sean
 

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The ones who can accept change and refinement are the ones currently digging up the Middle East (what's not being blown up :rolleyes: ) trying to learn more about the roots of Christianity and older religions :tu:...that's history, and I think it's fascinating.
Yeah, it's funny that despite being a heathen, I'm totally hooked on those biblical archeology shows on the History Channel. Especially the ones that get into mistakes made in translations that have led to the Bible of today being very different from some of the original texts.
 

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Deliciously Blunt
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Yeah, it's funny that despite being a heathen, I'm totally hooked on those biblical archeology shows on the History Channel. Especially the ones that get into mistakes made in translations that have led to the Bible of today being very different from some of the original texts.
ding ding ding...the exact reason why it's a guide...'facts' are muddled a bit by the factor of human memory and creativity.


BTW, Sean, I enjoyed reading that post. You said a bunch of things that I couldn't verbalize from my head or just didn't know. Good stuff!:tu:
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Agreed. I just think it's difficult for God and the "big bang" to coexist.
Maybe that's how God did it.

Maybe God isn't magic, he's just a dude sitting down at his work bench, throwing things together.

Example: the duck billed platypus

I'm curious about the whole story of Noah.

Seems to me its a story that gives an "idea" like Woody would say, but without being too big on facts or details.

For instance, there's no mention of animals making their way from places like Australia or how they got back for that matter.
 

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So why is it that if some Christians ask you about your faith and you reply that your are Jewish, Hindu, Buddhist, or whatever, they will usually leave you alone. But if you say you don't believe, they open up on you with both barrels. I respect anyone's right to believe in any god they want to and I have no want, need, or desire to convince them that I'm right or that they are wrong. I just wish I could be shown the same respect to believe something different. <getting off the soapbox now>
 

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Maybe God isn't magic, he's just a dude sitting down at his work bench, throwing things together.

Example: the duck billed platypus
lmfao! One of my favorite Far Side cartoons of all time was the one "God as a kid tries to create a chicken", with a surprised kid in front of a chemistry set and feathers everywhere.
I'm curious about the whole story of Noah.
Ever notice how every culture has a flood myth dating to about the same time frame? Like Songdog...I get totally sucked in to those shows. There's a ton of history in religion, for most of humanity's existence religion = politics = history, and now we're getting to the point we can understand what events some of those stories referred to, and the details in one line or one paragraph in a religious text.

I'll probably get smacked a little for this comparision :p...but anybody read "The Silmarillion"? The period of Tolkein's history of Middle Earth that was made in to three thick books and 10 or so hours of cinema takes up maybe two or three lines in a section pages long. I figure a lot of religions' and cultures' creation "myths" are a little bit "legend" as well, we just don't know the entire story yet, and one line probably has a few tomes behind it.

-Sean
 

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Discussion Starter #52
So why is it that if some Christians ask you about your faith and you reply that your are Jewish, Hindu, Buddhist, or whatever, they will usually leave you alone. But if you say you don't believe, they open up on you with both barrels. I respect anyone's right to believe in any god they want to and I have no want, need, or desire to convince them that I'm right or that they are wrong. I just wish I could be shown the same respect to believe something different. <getting off the soapbox now>
Its because they don't want you to burn in he!!

Actually, when you look at Christianity, it seems to have at its core a desire to convert others.

In religions like Judaism, you can only be born a Jew, you can't become one. I think its passed down through the mother.

In this case, I gotta agree with you. I'd prefer people to leave me alone if I tell them I don't follow the teachings of one religion or another.

A couple of women just came to my door a few minutes ago, no joke, and started telling me about the bihai faith. It seemed pretty interesting.
 

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I guess that's the unfortunate part. People can't just be saved themselves. They gotta save the rest of the world with them. Unfortunately, I've seen it tear many families apart, including my wife's.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
I guess that's the unfortunate part. People can't just be saved themselves. They gotta save the rest of the world with them. Unfortunately, I've seen it tear many families apart, including my wife's.
On my father's side they are Baptist and United.

They just don't talk religion and get along fine.

Then I walk into the room, spawn of Satan, then they wince and go back to what they were doing.
 

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Hickleberry, I bet you wondered how long it would take for this thread to become a debate about Evo vs. creationism :D LOL!

How long did you think it'd take?
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Well spunk munkey, I figure you just need to add 1 part Hicklebarry and 1 part Jans...and instantly there's a debate of logic vs somebody with the ability to cut and paste.
 

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Yanno, I actually did think it was gonna be a joke, being a post in TSBS by none other than TH :p...but I figured one reply when I saw the title and wandered over to see if it had turned to a sh!tstorm yet. Was I right, or was it three replies?

I'm amazed, very little poo flying around on this thread :eek:. I should unban Tunoma16 and invite him over.
 

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I am just trying to enlighten also. The Apostle Paul liked to discuss things too. I love this passage,
AC 17:16 While Paul was waiting for them in Athens, he was greatly distressed to see that the city was full of idols. 17 So he reasoned in the synagogue with the Jews and the God-fearing Greeks, as well as in the marketplace day by day with those who happened to be there. 18 A group of Epicurean and Stoic philosophers began to dispute with him. Some of them asked, "What is this babbler trying to say?" Others remarked, "He seems to be advocating foreign gods." They said this because Paul was preaching the good news about Jesus and the resurrection. 19 Then they took him and brought him to a meeting of the Areopagus, where they said to him, "May we know what this new teaching is that you are presenting? 20 You are bringing some strange ideas to our ears, and we want to know what they mean." 21 (All the Athenians and the foreigners who lived there spent their time doing nothing but talking about and listening to the latest ideas.)

AC 17:22 Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopagus and said: "Men of Athens! I see that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription: TO AN UNKNOWN GOD. Now what you worship as something unknown I am going to proclaim to you.

AC 17:24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 `For in him we live and move and have our being.' As some of your own poets have said, `We are his offspring.'

AC 17:29 "Therefore since we are God's offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone--an image made by man's design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead."

Enough said
So how are you related to Tunoma16?
 

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Leader of Group Evil
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So how are you related to Tunoma16?
You SPEAK-ah of the DE-VIL-ah! Not two seconds after I edit my post and utter his name, there he is again! He is related to the creature in playforcash's post.
 
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