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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Don't get me wrong. I love my 2006 4X4 DC... runs great with 48K miles on it. But towed small camper (3400lbs.) into headwind last weekend. Got real tired of the constant highway downshift to 3rd gear and 4k rpms to hold her at 65mph. Started me thinking diesel. Wish Toyota had one. Anyway started doing some research and was shocked at diesel prices. I admit to being a noob but I always thought I was paying a premium to own a Toyota! Wow those diesels are all high dollar even with high miles. Won't be making that deal any time soon. Am I missing something? Even trade on anything Ford, Dodge, or GM would require I look at nothing newer than 2003 with well over 100K miles (for 3/4 ton)... Ouch! Any new rumors on a Toyota diesel?
 

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With the economy in shambles and toyota's reputation dented I wouldn't hold my breath for such a vehicle.
 

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Don't get me wrong. I love my 2006 4X4 DC... runs great with 48K miles on it. But towed small camper (3400lbs.) into headwind last weekend. Got real tired of the constant highway downshift to 3rd gear and 4k rpms to hold her at 65mph. Started me thinking diesel. Wish Toyota had one. Anyway started doing some research and was shocked at diesel prices. I admit to being a noob but I always thought I was paying a premium to own a Toyota! Wow those diesels are all high dollar even with high miles. Won't be making that deal any time soon. Am I missing something? Even trade on anything Ford, Dodge, or GM would require I look at nothing newer than 2003 with well over 100K miles (for 3/4 ton)... Ouch! Any new rumors on a Toyota diesel?
I feel your pain. I had a 5k trailer and towed it all over the mountains of Washington state. While the Tundra did ok, it was a white knuckle affair. Well I worked out a sweet deal on a 2000 Ford F350 PSD. Now I have a 38ft 5er that hits the scales loaded and 12.5k. The truck pulls it nicely. Now the best part of the deal I sold it to my mom and I get to drive the Tundra and keep the PSD at the house. I tow over 5k a year and the ford is the best tow vehicle I have ever driven but for a daily driver the tundra kicks its but. If you want a good tow rig look at the 2000-2003 7.3l ( NOT the 6.no ) with a manual 5sp that is a rock solid rig. The Cam position sensor problems have been worked out. The older 5.9 dodge cummins are solid also.
 

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usually adding a diesel to a vehicle is in the neighborhood of a $7,000 option and those that can afford that usually go with other high end options on it too. that being said, diesels are usually more durable and should be able to run to 300k no problem. but with that kinda mileage, you have to worry about every other part of the vehicle too. so your engine might be purring like a kitten but starters, transmissions, suspension and even the fame can become a problem with high miles just like a gasser.

the diesel tundra is looking to be at least 3 years away unless you want to ship a Hilux from europe :)
 

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How ABOUT D4D :

Toyota 1VD-FTV engine is the first V8 diesel engine produced by Toyota. It is a 32-Valve DOHC, with Common Rail fuel injection and either one or two variable-geometry turbochargers.
* Designation: 1VD-FTV
* Type: V8 DOHC 32 Valve Variable Geometry Intercooled Turbo Diesel
* Displacement: 4,461 cc (272 cu in)
* Compression ratio: 16.8:1
* Bore x Stroke (mm): 86 x 96
* Fuel System: Common Rail Direct Injection
* Maximum power: Single turbo: 151 kW (202 hp) @ 3400 rpm[1]; Twin turbo: 195 kW (261 hp) at 3400 rpm[2]
* Maximum torque: Single turbo: 430 N·m (317 ft·lb) @ 1200-3200 rpm[1]; Twin turbo: 650 N·m (479 ft·lb) @ 1600-2600 rpm[2]
* Fuel Consumption (ADR81/02 combined): Single turbo: 11.9 l/100 km (23.7 mpg-imp; 19.8 mpg-US)[1]; Twin turbo: 10.3 l/100 km (27.4 mpg-imp; 22.8 mpg-US)[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_VD_engine#cite_note-LC200-1


Australia gets this engine, Europe, Middle East, AFRICA - states get 5.7 nad a truck that goes 0-60 in <7 seconds :D:D:D its a truck not a sports car


Effin Toyota - why oh why Europe gets all the goodies and USA gets screwed. Why they don't allow NG or LPG conversions when in Europe NG or LPG cost 1/2 of what gasoline or diesel cost in gas stations, MPG remains the same and cost with instalation is 1500-3000$ on passenger vehicles. I'd be drooling driving around with D4D or LPG conversion. Most cars in Europe are either diesel or gas conversion as it pays of in a year. Does not affect reliability of the engine, just saves you big bucks. Guess somebody is giving enough campaign cash for our dear politicians so they don't do nothing just gain beer guts :(
 

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Wouldn't expect it soon unless you want it carried here on a boat from Europe. The problem is the competitive market and funding. The Hino diesel is a I6 with like 3,000,000 ft/lbs torque, .2 HP, and red lines at a whopping 2400 rpm. Its a cool thought, but unless you plan on hauling around 50,000 lb trailers its not practical. I wish they would get someone, OTHER than Hino, to make a nice turbodiesel and put it in US market. I can guarantee they'd have at least one sold.

BTW, it sucks Toyota is so dedicated to passenger cars these days. Rumors are now circulating that the Sequoia may be cut. If it is, Tundra parts will be much less stocked making repairs, etc. longer and more expensive, plus they won't make as many options for them. I'd love to see the new Supra concept hit the market, sick car. Toyota - please do not cut the Tundra
 

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Hino is truck engine - there is D4D Land Cruiser engine. V8 TT good power to weight ratio. Ok screw the diesel - why not allow LPG or NG conversions - the whole Europe runs on that crap and its dirt cheap and greener energy than gasoline or diesel.
 

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If your thinking of a diesel, something to consider are the emission requirements:

2010 Diesel Emission Regulations Met with Urea ? Automotive News & Car Rumors at Automobile Magazine

Might be a factor in the price, but in my opinion, components on the front side (i.e. injectors) are being made more cost effective (cheaper) to offset the backside (i.e. after treatment devices) as they become more elaborate.

Going forward, you will need to fill the urea possibly at each oil change driving more cost to the consumer.

The result is more possible failures both mechanical or electrical as a whole.

In this case an older diesel engine would be more appealing.

Just my $0.02

<TUNDRA>
 

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usually adding a diesel to a vehicle is in the neighborhood of a $7,000 option and those that can afford that usually go with other high end options on it too. that being said, diesels are usually more durable and should be able to run to 300k no problem. but with that kinda mileage, you have to worry about every other part of the vehicle too. so your engine might be purring like a kitten but starters, transmissions, suspension and even the fame can become a problem with high miles just like a gasser.

the diesel tundra is looking to be at least 3 years away unless you want to ship a Hilux from europe :)
or mexico?:clown:
 

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What is LPG and NG? I know we aren't talking about Ladies Professional Golf here but what kinds of fuel are these? To my knowledge, European gasolines are higher octane than that of the States. I think the starting Anti Knock Index is like 91 octane or 92. A lot of gas stations over there offer 92, 94, and 97 octane at an everyday pump lol. I asked my sister in France to look out for that when I researched it a couple weeks ago. Can you imagine some moron here thinking that would make their car a race car and trying to run 97 octane fuel?
 

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If your thinking of a diesel, something to consider are the emission requirements:

2010 Diesel Emission Regulations Met with Urea ? Automotive News & Car Rumors at Automobile Magazine

Might be a factor in the price, but in my opinion, components on the front side (i.e. injectors) are being made more cost effective (cheaper) to offset the backside (i.e. after treatment devices) as they become more elaborate.

Going forward, you will need to fill the urea possibly at each oil change driving more cost to the consumer.

The result is more possible failures both mechanical or electrical as a whole.

In this case an older diesel engine would be more appealing.

Just my $0.02

<TUNDRA>

Or just run it off filtered used vegetable oil (Waste Vegetable Oil) which can be gotten for free. Nearly zero emissions. The number one problem with diesel emissions is the sulfur - using vegetable oil makes this a non-issue.

Sh!t, diesels make too much damn sense to have here in America.
 

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Well its not like everybody runs 98 - 93/95/95 are the grades. Majority just runs 93. Compression i a tad higher, but no harm done to USA vehicles exported to Europe - just adds one or two HP. LPG - liquid propane gas (think gas grill) NG - natural gas. Basically you get 10+ gallon tank in the trunk or instead or spare tire + delivery system. Car starts on gasoline, runs to operating temperature and switches to LPG/NG. The gas has octane of ~100 , natural gas burns cleaner and its 1/2 price of gasoline/diesel in Europe. Instalation is a breeze, cost depending on system. Prices run from 1000-5000$ for the system. Newest ones are being instaled to 0 miles car right of dealers lot and does not void engine warranty. Had that in my car for two years. No problems, just xtra money left in the pocket. Look up NG Honda Civic. These morons do not allow LPG/NG conversions, nor offer to buy any other than that. Its all about the power and control - government does not want average Joe to save a buck on the gas.
Natural gas compressor can be installed at your home (cost like $10K therefor not economical) but you can literally fill up at home if you got NG at your house.
 

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Vegetable oil is not feasible as there's not enough it for everyone. Natural gas they have for another 100+ years. Methane gas can be extracted from rotting organic materials. Instead dry stacking the trash and creating new mountains of them they should rather let it rot, decompose creating heat, gas and decreasing in size at the same time. The diesel is not really feasible in USA due to 99% of vehicles being gasoline. LPG/NG conversions would take 6-10 hours per vehicle to install at a cost of let say $3000, but you'd pay half price when filling up. That way everybody keep driving their cars, just retrofitting gas equipment and saving lots of money if you drive reasonable amount of miles per year.
 

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And of course this is entirely wishful thinking. In twenty-five years, all cars with run off of an electrical socket and plug. Ten times more economical. My money will be on solar power systems as well, not only on cars but on homes to provide the ever demanding power supply -- especially if you have to charge a car every night. Can you imagine electric stations or natural gas stations for extended trips?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
So I guess the prices I am seeing are accurate? If I wanna go diesel and not take on tons more payment, I gotta go with something much older and higher miles than the Tundra? Sheeesh!
 

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So I guess the prices I am seeing are accurate? If I wanna go diesel and not take on tons more payment, I gotta go with something much older and higher miles than the Tundra? Sheeesh!
Well look at the cost of a new diesel. You are looking at a lot more truck. 100k is just broke in for a diesel there is a forum for 1,000,000 club and many over 1,500,000 with no motor work done.
 

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Sorry to hijack this thread, but;

Its all about the power and control - government does not want average Joe to save a buck on the gas.
I agree in part up to government. It is my strong personal opinion that government is owned by oil companies - same as the auto manufacturers. Who stands to benefit from vehicles that are not as fuel efficient as possible? That, my friend, is the billion-trillion dollar question.

Vegetable oil is not feasible as there's not enough it for everyone.
Perhaps at current production levels. One of my soapbox speeches covers how vegetable oil would change the world. Farmers would be busy all the time, the leftover mash could be used to fertilize the fields or produce feed for live stock, and the environment would benefit. The combustion of vegetable oil releases less carbon than is consumed by the plants grown to produce it in the first place. One of the earliest books I read on the subject is "From Fryer to Fuel Tank" by Josh and Kai Tickell. Haphazard book but full of thought provoking concepts.

Natural gas they have for another 100+ years.
Yes.

Methane gas can be extracted from rotting organic materials. Instead dry stacking the trash and creating new mountains of them they should rather let it rot, decompose creating heat, gas and decreasing in size at the same time.
Finally someone else who sees this - Bravo!

The diesel is not really feasible in USA due to 99% of vehicles being gasoline.
I am not sure I understand the point here? There are a ton of diesel vehicles from trucks and buses to farm equipment, RV's, generators, and passenger cars. I say it is more feasible than electricity or LPG/NG as the infrastructure is already in place and the conversion to WVO requires far less than the conversion to LPG/NG.

LPG/NG conversions would take 6-10 hours per vehicle to install at a cost of let say $3000, but you'd pay half price when filling up. That way everybody keep driving their cars, just retrofitting gas equipment and saving lots of money if you drive reasonable amount of miles per year.
LPG/NG may be right for some people especially if the conversion not only pays for itself but saves money after the conversion payoff.
 

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I wouldn't rely on any type of synthetic or biological fuel as a long-term combustion engine fuel. I have a very hard time believing that the fuel we could make in 5-8 farming months could supply all the gasoline/diesel the United States needs. Furthermore a regress to a farming based economy solely to propel cars would cause more damage to our ailing economy and decrease business and international trade and revenue. There aren't always millions upon millions of crops, but there's always sun, water, and wind. Mother Nature is the best, and most consistent, energy supply currently available to humans, barring nuclear fission, which really still isn't available. Wind turbines, water turbines, solar panels, heck there are turbines that turn tides going in and out into power. Veggie oil may sound good in theory, but it is not a long term, reliable source of power and I personally don't think its the right direction for the US to move. I'm sure companies will try to find some money out of filtering processed veggie oil and selling it, but then are we going to convert to ALL diesel engines modified to run off veggie oil? I think that would be extreme and start monopolies based on who produces most of these specialized engines and then who makes fuel additives for the oil. It would be nothing short of an automotive revolution for this transformation that would severely affect just about every car manufacter. Electric motors and production is already here and thriving. It would be an utter waste to kill all the R&D put into Hybrid engines (while a veggie oil hybrid would be a NEW hybrid) and stop using them after 5 years. I'm not up for that change quite yet.. :abduction:
 
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