same here. I have been using fram or the cheapest filter when I change my oil and have never had problems with my engines using oil or needing motor overhauls. My last car was a bmw with 225,000 miles and never used any oil or smoked. I do change my oil every 5000 miles though.

 

same here. I have been using fram or the cheapest filter when I change my oil and have never had problems with my engines using oil or needing motor overhauls. My last car was a bmw with 225,000 miles and never used any oil or smoked. I do change my oil every 5000 miles though.

The rubber gasket has a tendency of coming apart from the filter. I purchased FRAM doubleguard brand when I replaced the oil on my Toyota Sequoia. Upon starting the truck, I discovered that I was leaking oil on the driveway. The leak was not noticeable until I started the vehicle. If you folks are going to continue using FRAM filters, ensure to check for leaks. I purchased a FUMOTO valve from Fumotovalve.com ($20.00). It made the process of changing oil easy also on my case I don't have to drain all the oil to replaced the oil filter.

 

I run Mobil 1 and with a fram filter I get a pronounced knock at startup. With a Toyota OEM filter not knock at startup. My understanding is the OEM filter has a stronger back backflow/stop valve (not sure if thats the right term). No other changes have been made and if I put the FRAM on it knocks at startup. And I don't think its unique to my truck.

 

I run Mobil 1 and with a fram filter I get a pronounced knock at startup. With a Toyota OEM filter not knock at startup. My understanding is the OEM filter has a stronger back backflow/stop valve (not sure if thats the right term). No other changes have been made and if I put the FRAM on it knocks at startup. And I don't think its unique to my truck.

It's not unique to your truck. My dad used FRAM or whatever cheap filter he could find, and his truck knocked at start up something fierce. I finally talked him into using the OEM or Purolator Pure 1 filter. No knock.

I've never used anything but Purolator Pure 1 on my Tundra. I don't know what would happen if I tried a FRAM, and I don't intend to find out.

 

Same deal on my Corolla. I would get a knock (and had it for years) when I started the car. I was using Fram for a long time but never new this was why. Once I read some of the info, I switched to factory and or PureOne. I now have no knock at startup. The Fram filter has cardboard end caps (the part that holds the actual filter material together) as well as what maintains pressure against the seals. Wet oil soaked cardboard is not that strong. They also have a very cheap plastic bypass valve. Spend the 2.99 and cut ANY Fram open and you'll see what I mean. I did a couple just to see and now use Factory Filters or Pure One only. On the Corolla the filter is up high on the motor and mounted sideways. What was happening was the oil would drain out and the car would have to refill the filter first. Probably not AS big an issue on our 4.7L since it mounts more vertically but I'm still not using it.

 

Same here, my 05 didn't have a knock when I first got it. After first oil change I switched to Mobil 1 synthetic blend oil with a FRAM oil filter, there came the knock. I dropped the oil after two thousand miles and went with full synthetic Mobil 1 with a BOSCH premium oil filter, knock disappeared. I would believe that it was the oil filter change that did it rather than the change to full synthetic oil.

 

I have used Hastings filters for years and have no start up knock from my '03 Tundra.
A poor anti drain back valve will let the oil drain out and that will cause the bearings to sing when first started after having set for a while. An old Ford we had at work would do that something terrible after having set over night.

 

I used Fram oil filters on my 89 Z-24 and changed the oil faithfully every 3,000 miles. (But not synthetic.)

Results? The engine siezed up at 102,000 and needed rebuilding. Sure, it could've been due to the GM engine (V-6) but I'll not buy a Fram ANYTHING to this day. (And I switched all my vehicles to full synthetic.)

There was a website some years back where a couple engineers bought every brand of oil filter they could get their hands on and tested them and even cut them up to see how good the filters were on the inside. Fram was one of the worse they tested. (I remember the Purolators scored neared the top.)

 

Filter test

I used Fram oil filters on my 89 Z-24 and changed the oil faithfully every 3,000 miles. (But not synthetic.)

Results? The engine siezed up at 102,000 and needed rebuilding. Sure, it could've been due to the GM engine (V-6) but I'll not buy a Fram ANYTHING to this day. (And I switched all my vehicles to full synthetic.)

There was a website some years back where a couple engineers bought every brand of oil filter they could get their hands on and tested them and even cut them up to see how good the filters were on the inside. Fram was one of the worse they tested. (I remember the Purolators scored neared the top.)

Here is the test that I had seen. Positives are that it at least gives you some insght to filter construction. Negative is that it does not test actual filtering ability. "Logical" assumptions are that the larger filter with more surface area will filter better. This is not true, it gives you more filter area but the actual media and bypass valve would determine what it will filter i.e. actual particle size. Think a piece of regular swiss cheese vs. baby swiss. The only way to really test that would be to set them up with the same exact oil with same dirt level with some back pressure and flow meters then also oil analysis to the micron level of dirt left. Too much for me. I cut some open and I'll stick with the 2 I mentioned. The Amsoil and Mobil 1 are probably excellent but cost and availability of factory and Pure One make them best for me.

 

FRAM FILTER WITH HOLES THROUGH THE MEDIA, 6000 MILES 4 CYL CAMRY

MORE FRAM HOLES THROUGH MEDIA, 4000 MILES TOYOTA V6

ANOTHER FRAM

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=002272;p=1

Why buy a vehicle with a multi-thousand dollar engine and skimp on filters? The money you save won't buy lunch. I think Frams high priced filters are OK, but not worth the price. You can get an equally good filter for the standard price from Purolator or WIX/NAPA-Gold. Fram also puts their same filters into cans for Pennzoil, Mobil, Defender, and other brands.


Ken

 

fram & purolator

Thought I would put in my 2 cents worth. I was a field tech for Wix filters awhile back.Fram was the worst spin on oil filter on the market.Yes it has cardboard end caps, a very weak anti drain back valve & very irregular spaced paper pleats.It's filtering factor was rated a 33 micron, which is the size of a hair on your arm. However there was no SAE measurment for microns; so their 33 micron could have been what ever size they put in their pleated paper.The start up engine knock you are refering to is caused by the weak anti drain back valve, not holding the oil in the can, like someone stated.Also some filters have a by-pass valve in the filter if required by the vehicle manufacture. It was also weak.When it malfunctions oil pressure gets too high & blows the filter off the mount.
Purolator was also not a top grade filter. It had a piece of common string wrapped around the pleated paper & very irregular pleats in the paper like fram.What do you think hot oil does to the string? They did have metal end caps& a good anti drain back valve.

Wix & napa gold are excellent filters, in oil,air
& fuel.Air & fuel are a whole
issue by themselves!
Just wanted to pass along my experiences in the field.

Tundra 39

 

10 years ago, in my stupid younger years, I used the fram oil filter on my 18RG race motor on a 73 toyota corolla sprinter. I was racing at the back lanes of Travis Airforce base, Fairfield ca with a bunch of other street racers 2AM in the morning.
It was my turn to run someone with a V8 Cuda. First and second gear hook-up nice that I was a car lenght ahead of the cuda. Third gear, I felt like the tach RPM spung faster than normal and I got side ways doing 85 mph.
At 4th gear the engine felt like it was struggling to get to the end of the 1/4 mile. Beat the cuda by 1/3 car lenght

Once done and got back to park the car, I check the engine to see if there is anything loose. Guess what, I do not have any more oil filter. The filter blew off! On top of that, the cops came and run as out! Lucky, I told the cops that I was just waiting for a friend to tow my car and just happen to be there watching while I was waiting for him to tow me home

Long story short, FRAM SUCKS.

- Weak anti drain valve. More like none existance anti drain valve causing your engine to do dry starts after a period of not driving.
- Rubber gasket tend to slide off causing the filter to get loose and blow off
- Less filter element or pleats.
- My dilemma 10 years ago was a $3000.00 lesson why FRAM sucks!!!!

 

I've been using Fram filters forever and haven't had a problem with them. What's the big stink with Fram?!?!

I've been using Fram filters on most of my cars for over 40 years. My first cars had Fram as the original equipment. I've got a 78 Rabbit that has had nothing but Fram filters and the engine is still in good shape after 250K. Most of the older air-cooled VW's never had a filter, just a strainer screen in the sump. One thing that I have noticed is that the Fram name has been bought out by various companies over the years such as Allied Signal and more recently Honeywell. Like most companies, they are in business to make money and no doubt they have cheapened their product due to greed like everyone else, including Toyota. I've seen the pictures of the media with the holes in it and I don't like it. The filter can in the background doesn't look like a Fram though. Be aware that the new NAPA "Pro Select" and "Nascar Select" filter lines are lesser quality filters than "Napa Gold." Even though they advertise "spin flow" technology, the Napa Gold is supposed to have the higher quality fiberglas media where the Nascar Select has fiberglas and paper. The Pro Select is the same as the former Silverline filter and has paper media. Maybe the "Wix guy" can give us more details.

 

I've been using Fram filters forever and haven't had a problem with them. What's the big stink with Fram?!?!

I only heard a lot of negative talk about Frams oil filter when I owned a Chevy years before I got the Tundra. Mainly do to poor construction of the filter and causing oil leeks or something to that affect. Since then I've mainly stuck to WIX oil filters with no problem even though its a few extra bucks over the price of a FRAM. Either way, I gotta make this investment(truck) last, so why not spend the extra bucks.

 

10 years ago, in my stupid younger years, I used the fram oil filter on my 18RG race motor on a 73 toyota corolla sprinter. I was racing at the back lanes of Travis Airforce base, Fairfield ca with a bunch of other street racers 2AM in the morning.
It was my turn to run someone with a V8 Cuda. First and second gear hook-up nice that I was a car lenght ahead of the cuda. Third gear, I felt like the tach RPM spung faster than normal and I got side ways doing 85 mph.
At 4th gear the engine felt like it was struggling to get to the end of the 1/4 mile. Beat the cuda by 1/3 car lenght

Once done and got back to park the car, I check the engine to see if there is anything loose. Guess what, I do not have any more oil filter. The filter blew off! On top of that, the cops came and run as out! Lucky, I told the cops that I was just waiting for a friend to tow my car and just happen to be there watching while I was waiting for him to tow me home

Excellent story.

You should have submitted this to Car & Driver for 10 Best story.

 

I used to use Fram until I changed the oil in my wife's Odyssey one day. Took the old filter off, spun the new one on, refilled with oil. She went to the store and called me on her cell phone because her oil light came on. Upon closer inspection, the rubber gasket at the end from the old filter had baked onto the filter plate. I had "double gasketed" the new filter and oil was leaking from the poor seal.

Now I only use Hastings filters, or OEM. I wipe down the mounting plate as a confirmation that I checked and found nothing adhered to the plate. That was almost an expensive lesson to learn!

 

I used to use Fram until I changed the oil in my wife's Odyssey one day. Took the old filter off, spun the new one on, refilled with oil. She went to the store and called me on her cell phone because her oil light came on. Upon closer inspection, the rubber gasket at the end from the old filter had baked onto the filter plate. I had "double gasketed" the new filter and oil was leaking from the poor seal.

Now I only use Hastings filters, or OEM. I wipe down the mounting plate as a confirmation that I checked and found nothing adhered to the plate. That was almost an expensive lesson to learn!

Hey, I did almost the same with the Fram filter (back when I used them) I backed the car out of the garage to put the jack, etc, away and noticed a HUGE pool of oil under the car.....the old gasket was stuck on the car so the new filter wasn't seated....

POS Fram filters! (I also double-check that, now, with ANY filter)

Boo

 

fram problems

I've been using Fram filters on most of my cars for over 40 years. My first cars had Fram as the original equipment. I've got a 78 Rabbit that has had nothing but Fram filters and the engine is still in good shape after 250K. Most of the older air-cooled VW's never had a filter, just a strainer screen in the sump. One thing that I have noticed is that the Fram name has been bought out by various companies over the years such as Allied Signal and more recently Honeywell. Like most companies, they are in business to make money and no doubt they have cheapened their product due to greed like everyone else, including Toyota. I've seen the pictures of the media with the holes in it and I don't like it. The filter can in the background doesn't look like a Fram though. Be aware that the new NAPA "Pro Select" and "Nascar Select" filter lines are lesser quality filters than "Napa Gold." Even though they advertise "spin flow" technology, the Napa Gold is supposed to have the higher quality fiberglas media where the Nascar Select has fiberglas and paper. The Pro Select is the same as the former Silverline filter and has paper media. Maybe the "Wix guy" can give us more details.

Dude Boy
It is hard to tell with the pictures if it is fram or not. What ever it is has been well used. I went through the Wix plant in Gastonia N.C. & the Puolator plant in Fayettville N.C.awhile back. Since I left Wix I really haven't kept up with the recent brands except Wix.I know Wix is still making the gold NAPA. The only experience I've had with fram was on a 430 Buick in a sprint car.After 2 snap barrell rolls & an end over into the wall, the filter was gone, along with most of the car, when we finally got it on the trailer.Can't blame fram for that one, just pilot error.
I have never seen a filter blow off an engine without it being a bad pressure relief valve. Even if the gasket is loose on the can it should seal when the filter is tightened. What I have seen is leakers due to installing with a dry seal or using a heavy grease,like wheel bearing grease on the seal.I have also seen the double gasket thing like J. Law had. We always said to use a little bit of fresh oil or drain oil, if it is clean, on your finger & wipe it on the new seal.Hydraulic installs the same way.
What do think the guys using Fram on hydraulics said when I cut one of their filters open & they saw the cardboard endcaps? Those were the easiest fleet sales you could make!!
Like I said previously ,there isn't an SAE rating on micron ratings, so they can just about advertise whatever they want about filtering media & be safe.You get what you pay for.

Hope this helps, Bob!

Tundra 39
Another Bob

 

Tundra39: I wasn't reading very carefully the other night, and didn't realize at the time that you were the "Wix guy." Sorry, if I offended you. I don't know how long the Fram spin-on filters have had the cardboard ends, but if they stay on, what does it hurt? I know the old C-4 Fram filters (cartridge type) that came on my old Ford, appeared to have some cardboard on the ends. At work, I have some ammonia compressors that have Fram cartridge filters and I think they are cardboard too. Why be so afraid of cardboard in the filter, when the media is often made out of filter paper? I have some other ammonia compressors that have Schroeder cartridge filters with metal end caps, and have seen a couple times where the end caps separate from the media when you remove the filter. In the cases where some of the fellows posting here had leaks due to leaving an extra gasket in place - well, that was their own fault (negligence) and not Fram's. If they didn't know the extra gasket was there, that means they never cleaned the mounting surface, and made sure there was no dirt, or anything else on there either. I wonder if they oiled the seal when they installed that original filter, or even tightened it correctly? I remember digging up to 2 or 3 old gaskets out while changing a filter on an older Chev V8 back before they had spin-on filters. That's almost excusable though, because they are pretty hard to detect up in that groove. I'll have to cut some of my old Frams apart to see how bad they look inside. Does anyone else have trouble with rust forming inside new filters stored in an unheated garage? It seems like they could spray some rust prevenative inside to insure against that.

 

Tundra39: I wasn't reading very carefully the other night, and didn't realize at the time that you were the "Wix guy." Sorry, if I offended you. I don't know how long the Fram spin-on filters have had the cardboard ends, but if they stay on, what does it hurt? I know the old C-4 Fram filters (cartridge type) that came on my old Ford, appeared to have some cardboard on the ends. At work, I have some ammonia compressors that have Fram cartridge filters and I think they are cardboard too. Why be so afraid of cardboard in the filter, when the media is often made out of filter paper? I have some other ammonia compressors that have Schroeder cartridge filters with metal end caps, and have seen a couple times where the end caps separate from the media when you remove the filter. In the cases where some of the fellows posting here had leaks due to leaving an extra gasket in place - well, that was their own fault (negligence) and not Fram's. If they didn't know the extra gasket was there, that means they never cleaned the mounting surface, and made sure there was no dirt, or anything else on there either. I wonder if they oiled the seal when they installed that original filter, or even tightened it correctly? I remember digging up to 2 or 3 old gaskets out while changing a filter on an older Chev V8 back before they had spin-on filters. That's almost excusable though, because they are pretty hard to detect up in that groove. I'll have to cut some of my old Frams apart to see how bad they look inside. Does anyone else have trouble with rust forming inside new filters stored in an unheated garage? It seems like they could spray some rust prevenative inside to insure against that.

Dude Boy(Bob)
Hey, it's hard to offend someone when they don't know much.That is way I never get offended! I wish I still had the test lab reports on Fram, but I don't.I remember the cardboard showed signs of deteration from hot oil but don't remember how severe.Now that engines are operating at a higher running temperature, I would be more concerned.The filtering media(paper) is made for the specific purpose of fine filtration under extreme operating conditions. It is formed on a sizing drum in a room with very high humidity so the paper doesn't break while being shaped to fit in the end caps. It is applied with an adhesive called plastisol.The adhesion factor is another reason metal end caps are used except for fram's cardboard. At one time Cat, Cummins,Thermoking & Carrier factory service centers were told not to use Fram.My biggest account in Phoenix was the Cat dealer, who used Wix as a secondary & supplemental filter .They could only use OE filters on their own equipment unless it wasn't available through Cat, then it was Wix.Great testimonial.
I am real curious if they are still using cardboard end caps.I know there have been a lot of changes since I left the filter industry & i don't even try to keep up with it!! A question** How can you trade a Tundra for a Toyota Spyder & still be a farmer? We need an "ask Andy" connection, huh!!
Have a good one

Bob

 

Thought I would put in my 2 cents worth. I was a field tech for Wix filters awhile back.Fram was the worst spin on oil filter on the market.Yes it has cardboard end caps, a very weak anti drain back valve & very irregular spaced paper pleats.It's filtering factor was rated a 33 micron, which is the size of a hair on your arm. However there was no SAE measurment for microns; so their 33 micron could have been what ever size they put in their pleated paper.The start up engine knock you are refering to is caused by the weak anti drain back valve, not holding the oil in the can, like someone stated.Also some filters have a by-pass valve in the filter if required by the vehicle manufacture. It was also weak.When it malfunctions oil pressure gets too high & blows the filter off the mount.
Purolator was also not a top grade filter. It had a piece of common string wrapped around the pleated paper & very irregular pleats in the paper like fram.What do you think hot oil does to the string? They did have metal end caps& a good anti drain back valve.

Wix & napa gold are excellent filters, in oil,air
& fuel.Air & fuel are a whole
issue by themselves!
Just wanted to pass along my experiences in the field.

Tundra 39

I have heard that Walmart "Super Tech" filters were made by Champion and had a good rating. Any thoughts??--Buzz

 

Walmart& Champion

I have heard that Walmart "Super Tech" filters were made by Champion and had a good rating. Any thoughts??--Buzz

Buzz
My question is who rated them?How were they tested? Walmart is a mass merchandiser who buys on price. I would be very apprehensive about their quality without knowing !!!

Tundra39

 

Buzz
My question is who rated them?How were they tested? Walmart is a mass merchandiser who buys on price. I would be very apprehensive about their quality without knowing !!!

Tundra39

Dont know--Im on a motorcycle site the gives them a good rating. Im also a little suspect of anything with the Walmart name on it. They demand such a low price on everything they sell --you have to expect they are on the bottom of the quality list. They also have come out with a "Walmart" brand Syn oil. Dont know who makes it. If anybody knows ---please post, ---Buzz

 

RE: What's the big stink with Fram?

I can't speak about FRAM, but I always used Toyota filters on my 1990 Pickup 4x4 . When I bought it several people advised me to use only OEM, so I did. I drove if for 248,000 miles and sold it for my 04 Tundra D-cab.

I've been using Fram filters forever and haven't had a problem with them. What's the big stink with Fram?!?!

 

My buddy ran a fram on his bronco...the seal blew. Luckily he actually checks his gauges and was in a parking lot so all he had to do was get a new filter and oil. Is it really worth saving 3 bucks for a questionable filter? I think not.